Why do Martin Logans have such Lousy resale value and interest?

[wings]

Selling speakers

I have sold quite a few things on audiogon and even locally on craigslist; the hardest to sell has always been speakers. Even when I had my recently listed Acoustic Zen Adagios priced at 50 % off ($4300 list), they didn't sell until I lowered the price to $2K.
Hard Times, yes...but not impossible if priced right!

You just need to make the item 'a great deal' so they can't pass it up.
Will you loose money...of course, but if you get a great deal on your next pair of speakers it kind of balances things out somewhat.

It took ~3 weeks into my adagios ad before they sold.

I had a friend attend the last CES in Vegas where he fell in love with the new Zu Essence speakers. When the speakers finally arrived at the dealer they did not sound like he remembered and did not care for them; he stated the dealer used different amp/preamp/CD player/cables....synergy in motion!
He's still looking for his next speaker.

 

[Gordon Gray]

Not I Fishman.

Seems pretty obvious to me as I suggested this in a previous thread.

GG

PS: Thanks Rich for your observations. Spot on as always.

 

[FISH_MAN]

Not I Fishman.

Seems pretty obvious to me as I suggested this in a previous thread.

GG

PS: Thanks Rich for your observations. Spot on as always.

It was not directed at anybody in particular

 

[Kevmars]

I bought a pair of used Ascents in '07. I buy used because that's what I can afford right now. My whole system is "high end" used, lol. My friends think I'm crazy for the money I've spent on the used equiment. They have no idea how must this stuff cost new. I paid 1800 for my MLs and currently most Ascents are going for 2000+. Regulars and i's. Martin Logans resale fine. The op mentioned his Spires and some Magnepan 3.6s and compared selling time. Remember the Maggies sold for $2000+. The Spires were $9k new and are selling for little over just about half. Of course the Maggies are going to sell first.

 

[Bernard]

It was not directed at anybody in particular

And still it continues, ad nauseum.

 

[Jungle Jack]

Hello,
I think the prices of the speakers post Shoreline are the ones taking the biggest hit in resale. The older pre Shoreline models all seem to be selling for better prices relative to age and original retail.

The reasons are myriad and some would say the newer, smaller units are just not the same.
Every time I visit my younger Brother in Orlando I am stunned at how much bigger and imposing his dual Ascent i, Theater i, Descent i system is. I hate to say it, but they probably appear to someone not familiar with ML as being much more expensive than my Vantages.

I am a Vantage, Stage, Vista, Montage owner and still love my speakers and am glad I purchased them. It did help that I purchased the Stage and Vista's for silly prices when Tweeter/Sound Advice was going under.
ML

 

[Gordon Gray]

And still it continues, ad nauseum.

So it seems Bernard.

Gordon

 

[tonepub]

I think it's tough reselling anything that requires major shipping. Most people are probably hesitant to buy something from a stranger that has a high possibility of getting damaged/destroyed in shipping with questionable recourse.

That would be my guess. Having shipped a few really expensive pieces this year (and those of you who have bought something from me know how obsessive I am about packing), I was on pins and needles until the packages arrived safely.

I can only imagine the guy on the other end felt the same way. Easier to just go to your favorite dealer and put it in the trunk sometimes....

 

[Victor]

Hi Mantana,
$5K+ for Spires is an absolute bargain !

I can't even get a tankful of petrol for that in the UK these days
Just a pity that yours are thousands of miles away !

It's unfortunate that you've had a rough ride with your MLs. It happens to all of us at some point....but we survive.
Hope you get them sold soon...

Kind regards....................................Victor.

 

[Mantana]

Hi Mantana,
$5K+ for Spires is an absolute bargain !

I can't even get a tankful of petrol for that in the UK these days
Just a pity that yours are thousands of miles away !

It's unfortunate that you've had a rough ride with your MLs. It happens to all of us at some point....but we survive.
Hope you get them sold soon...

Kind regards....................................Victor.

I remember when i bought the Spires for 20% off ($7100 total),
I thought IF i wanted to sell them in 6 months i wouldn't take
too big a hit. Well, with this economy i'm not surprised they're
not selling. However, i am surprised at the total lack of interest
from my ads. Maybe i'm overpriced, but i expected a few inquiries,
being a new design. Where are all the ML owners wanting
to upgrade? I always thought my Montanas would be extremely
difficult to unload, since the company is not very well known.
Just surprises the hell out of me they are the only pair
generating responses (and i list them at a higher price).

It's only been a few days on Agon now at the lower price of
$5250. Someone else is selling for $4900. It'll be interesting
to see if that pair sells and how long it takes. It's day 22 on
her ad. Cheers Victor.

 

[FISH_MAN]

I remember when i bought the Spires for 20% off ($7100 total),
I thought IF i wanted to sell them in 6 months i wouldn't take
too big a hit. Well, with this economy i'm not surprised they're
not selling. However, i am surprised at the total lack of interest
from my ads. Maybe i'm overpriced, but i expected a few inquiries,
being a new design. Where are all the ML owners wanting
to upgrade? I always thought my Montanas would be extremely
difficult to unload, since the company is not very well known.
Just surprises the hell out of me they are the only pair
generating responses (and i list them at a higher price).

It's only been a few days on Agon now at the lower price of
$5250. Someone else is selling for $4900. It'll be interesting
to see if that pair sells and how long it takes. It's day 22 on
her ad. Cheers Victor.

alright I am sorry but I must say something. why would you buy something like an $8,500.00 pair of speakers with the idea of selling them in six months that is just ridiculous now you are going to blame the economy and the speaker brand for your lack of sale you get what you deserve in my opinion.

 

[Mantana]

alright I am sorry but I must say something. why would you buy something like an $8,500.00 pair of speakers with the idea of selling them in six months that is just ridiculous now you are going to blame the economy and the speaker brand for your lack of sale you get what you deserve in my opinion.

Good question fish...

I'm kind of a speaker nut. Amplifiers and CD players are just tools
to drive the speaker, so i tend to keep my electronics for years. But,
speakers i like to swap out every 5 years or so. I kept one pair of
Montanas for 10 years and just bought the EPS2s a couple of years
ago. I've always loved the Montana sound, but was hesitant to
upgrade to the EPS2s because of their weight and the urge to
try something different. Afterward, i was glad i did, but you
know, i'm always keeping my eye out for the "perfect speaker".
I've always admired Logans for their detail and transparency
so i auditioned them a couple of times, then bought.

To answer your question...why would i buy an $8500 speaker
with the intention of selling in 6 months? Of course i didn't
intend to sell in 6 months. I was hoping to get better
sound with a smaller footprint and much less weight.
My intention was to sell the Montanas...didn't
work out like i thought. Are you trying to say you've never
bought a new pair of speakers and once home changed
your mind over time. Unfortunately, we can't sit at
the dealer and audition for days at a time. I'm not saying
Logans are crappy speakers. When i listen to the Spires
i don't think, "these speakers suck". I think they're very
good in fact, but i've also mentioned my issues with my
associated electronics and i decided i didn't want to spend
more money on amps and have more stuff to sell.
So, you might not like my observations and say "you get
what you deserve". That's ok, i don't wish you the same ill will.
I have both speakers up for sale, will sell either one
(or both) and be happy. If the Montanas sell, then i will get
serious about looking for a different amp for the Spire. If
the Spires sell, i'll probably do nothing for a few years
until the bug hits again. Who needs two pairs of speakers?

 

[Kruppy]

Seems to me after watching Audiogon over the past couple of years that audio sales/interest tends to cycle with the seasons. I would bet that you would get more interest in the fall.

 

[Gordon Gray]

Please keep us all advised regarding the status of selling one or both of your speaker systems.

We are all waiting with bated breath.

 

[Mantana]

Please keep us all advised regarding the status of selling one or both of your speaker systems.

We are all waiting with bated breath.

I'm sure you are G. Gray....it's always a pleasure to hear your
venomous sarcasm. You may not like my postings, or me for that
matter, but i always treat people on this site with respect. All
except you of course, whose comments i disregard.

 

[Jungle Jack]

While I am used to my posts not eliciting responses, I truly believe that the speakers since ML sold to Shoreline do not have the same resale value as the older generation. Ascent i's seem to be worth about as much as Vantages.

So again, I would say that resale value has suffered since the new generation and new ownership.

Mantana, if you do not follow the party line, you are often deemed a troll.

 

[MPS]

IMHO
- it is common knowledge that ELS-panels have issues ( not really da case with ML )
- ELS-panels have limited lifespan ( 5-20 years )

Example: new speakers selling for 10000€ are still worth ~3500€ after 4 years. Possible buyer is considering the need for repaneling ~2500€ just in case to make sure he's on the safe side he's willing to pay ~1500€ for the used speakers.
I seriously think that limited lifespan and high cost of repaneling is holding back even the sales of new pairs of MLs in this market area. The original arrangement (in USA) of easy and cost effective maintanance of ML panels is/was the right solution of creating the market for "exotic" product like ELS MLs.

 

[Gordon Gray]

Mantana,

What do you expect when you start a thread on a site dedicated to users who trully like ML speakers and start what is clearly meant to be an antagonistic thread questioning the resale value and price / point value of a product we all respect?

Many, including myself, strongly feel that ML speakers offer outstanding performance for the price.

You're absolutely correct regarding my feelings towards you based on this thread.

Do you go on the Montana speaker site or a site that supports Montana speakers / users proclaiming the same as you have here?

GG

 

[Mantana]

Point taken G. Gray...i'll give you that one. My posting title was
inflammatory. Actually, I tried to edit it right after i submitted it
but the site wouldn't let me. I'll remember that next time.
I should have said "Why are CLXs, Summits and Spires selling at
such big discounts". It still surprises me with the huge ML owner
and fan base. And i'm not the ML hater as you believe. I'm not going
to sell my Spires at just any price.

And guess what...i just had an email inquiring about the Spires.
Some interest after all.

 

[TomDac]

This is not the "love ML's or else" site... each member has the right to their own opinion and this forum is a place to express those feelings and opinions.

Mantana, I hope you sell your MLs and find happiness with something else.. After all, finding audio nirvana is what it's all about...:music:

I believe everyone else has answered your question... but do an a'Gon search for Magnepan, Pass Labs, or any other high end brand.. There are a lot of things on the used market right now.. Lots of people are out of work and having to sacrifice things to make ends meet.