Surround sound and movie vs. Stereo and music

[RCHeliGuy]

I find that I have a HUGE dichotomy in my thinking about music vs. movies.

For movies I just can't get myself excited about getting the sound quality at the same level. I assumed that there would be trickle down and I would feel compelled to update my multi-media system, but I just haven't gotten that at all. My mid fi 7.2 Yamaha receiver, Definitive Center & Surrounds & Velodyne sub capture the dynamics of a movie and have impact.

To be fair I have a separate media room from my stereo so maybe it is easier for me to see them as separate things.

My guess is that if your listening room is the same as your media room that the problems is your starting point. If you "grow" your media system from your stereo everything else has to be similar or it doesn't match.

Thoughts? Do any of you have separate stereo and media rooms with a different priority for each?

 

[Hocky]

1 system for me - there is no reason why one system can't be good at both.

 

[Rich]

I have completely separate systems, but both are located in the same room. And both are pretty high end. The multichannel system has an Oppo source to a Marantz pre/pro feeding 200 wpc to 11 channels of definitive technologies speakers and three subs (two of which are in the def tech mains and the third of which is an ML Descent) with Audyssey surround processing. All in a highly acoustically treated room. Makes for an awesome movie experience.

 

[Gordon Gray]

I also have two independent systems in the same room. SQ is very different.

I pay much more attention to my two channel. My Denon receiver / satellite speaker based HT system does just fine for its intended purpose but can't come close to my dedicated audio rig. Nor do I expect it to.

GG

 

[Brad225]

I have two systems in separate rooms now. Most of my MCH/2Ch have always been in the same room.

I had kind of lost serious interest in 2 channel music for about 15+ years. Then when I started into MCH 14 years ago, 2 channel became an interesting again.

I don't listen to any multi channel music though. It is just for TV/movies.

 

[RCHeliGuy]

It's interesting because I was reading about an album, Roger Waters, "Amused to Death" which is supposed to have some very interesting work with phase information such that 2 channel music has things sounding like they are coming from the side and behind you. I read that your stereo had to be set up perfectly for the phasing to work properly.

However it also has a surround sound version that I assume does the same thing more directly without playing phasing games and probably achieving the same result MUCH easier.

 

[Rich]

It's interesting because I was reading about an album, Roger Waters, "Amused to Death" which is supposed to have some very interesting work with phase information such that 2 channel music has things sounding like they are coming from the side and behind you. I read that your stereo had to be set up perfectly for the phasing to work properly.

Can confirm. I have that CD in 2-channel. It is wickedly spooky.

 

[RCHeliGuy]

Can confirm. I have that CD in 2-channel. It is wickedly spooky.

Well that just jumped into my Cart Along with Momentary Lapse of Reason.

 

[Rehan Azim Hashmi]

Hi, Mark. Trust you are okay and doing well.

Our family does not have a television. We do have three computers. Two laptops and one desktop.

Super hero and science fiction movies are watched in the movie theatre. Look forward to watching the captain America movie at the local mall movie theatre.

Our audio system is optimized for two channel stereo music listening. In the near future we plan to invest in new cls panels. The original ones still work well.

Buying new panels now is a hedge against panel price increase in the future.

Mark hope you have fun listening to music.

 

[Brad225]

Rich is correct about this album, i'm sure you will enjoy it Mark. The horse and buggy, for me, is the best. It starts on your left side goes along the wall, across the front, and up the right wall to beside you.

 

[RUR]

It's interesting because I was reading about an album, Roger Waters, "Amused to Death" which is supposed to have some very interesting work with phase information such that 2 channel music has things sounding like they are coming from the side and behind you.

It's a great album, made better by the use of Qsound processing. See here for a partial list of albums using the technology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QSound#Adoption

A similar technology, Shure HTS Stereosurround, is also fun. I have precisely one album using it: Spies' "By Way of the World". If you like jazz fusion, you might want to pick it up.

 

[RCHeliGuy]

There is something funny about this.

Qsound creates effects that we consider cool specifically because it is creating an effect that seems difficult for 2 speakers.

There is a pile of surround sound music and of course video available that comes at you from all directions and arguably does it much better, but that is no biggie because they are using extra speakers.

Things are obviously more fun when they defy expectations

 

[blee]

For those with 1 system for both HT and music, when listening to music, do you tend to listen in 7-channel Stereo mode or just 2 channel Stereo?

 

[roberto]

Hola Blee... I am going to chime a little bit here. One of the things that ML does, is to produce an incredible sound stage. In other words, you can see with your mind, where the musician(s) are playing at the imaginary stage right there, in your own place. If you play 7.1 in stereo, there will be no stage at all.

What you will get is a lot of music surrounding you. But there will be no stage at all.

The holographic sound of the stage with a sense of truly 3D is granted only with your main front speakers. Your system, the quality of it, will make this and here is where you have a big world in your hands. Also we touch the subjective part, where some might claim that even a connector right at your speaker or amplifier makes a difference.

Your liking and taste of the music is the clue. And what I do like, not necessary must be your liking. Answering your question, in a general way of speaking, we, the audiophile guys, we do use only Stereo for critical listening. And here is where we use a lot of different values, and are used to express our feelings regarding what we a listening. We listen to the air that are between each instrument. The timbre, and the size of the instruments, as an example, a violin vs a piano or a guitar. Brass and percussion instruments must preserve their natural tonalities keeping the right sense of image and stage. Also, we receive the feeling of the musician(s) playing that musical work! Their communication, their behaviour regarding with their musical instruments or voices. The nuances of the music, their expression with the music is what we do care. This imaginary world is breath taking. And that's why there are so many brands and so many different electronic paths to provide all these things. Emotional is what the music is!

You will discover this soon...just listen of the quality of each instrument and where it is located. If you are listening to a jazz combo, usually quintets or quartets, where is located each instrument. If you are not getting this, you must move your seat or your speakers to a precise point where you get suddenly this imaginary stage. Vocals must stay in a certain place, and next or behind are the musicians that are playing. For location and easy way to learn this imaginary stage...play a dvd in stereo, and try to listen if the instruments are where the real image is. In other words, the guitar at the left, the piano at right, the bass player a little bit back and to the left and drums at the back center right. The sax usually next to the singer...

Setting your system is very important. Too much bass energy, will make to have the bass player next to you on some bass notes and not at the stage where he or she should be. So, the adjustment of your system is very important.

Happy listening!

 

[Hocky]

For those with 1 system for both HT and music, when listening to music, do you tend to listen in 7-channel Stereo mode or just 2 channel Stereo?

Always 2 channel.

 

[RCHeliGuy]

I would suggest that a HT system has different priorities.

It should be very dynamic and be able to shake the walls, because movies have special effects to get a response and being perfectly accurate really isn't important as getting an emotional response.

When there is an explosion it doesn't matter if it is completely accurate. It matters if it has impact. That's not to say it shouldn't sound good, but past a point if you are caught up in the movie it just has to support what you are watching.

 

[amey01]

Always 2 channel.

+1

I thought multi-channel was a phase that was mostly passed.

 

[stuwee]

I'd like to touch on Roberto's post, placement is everything in 2 channel with ML's the amp and pre is secondary, listen to Pink Floyd's 'Wish you were Here' David is sitting on a stool, his vocal perfectly placed in the middle about 4 foot off the floor, you can measure the accurate distance of his hands on the fret and between his strum/pick hand, several other tracks on the CD, or Lp, extend waaay past the sides of the speakers. I think PF used tricks to make this happen, I don't care for surround sound, in wall, in ceiling speakers, just my opinion. Only a nice 2 channel set up for me!

I do have a pair of old Marantz HD880's hooked up to the bluray player and a SAE amp, I get all the stuff I need to make movies a pleasure to hear, that's just me.

 

[RCHeliGuy]

It's sad how quickly a topic can get you thinking..

I just found this stand below which seemed pretty inexpensive, then I purchased a 60-100" TV wall mount, and THEN things took a turn for the worst

http://www.parts-express.com/sanus-afab-33-tall-tv-av-stand--240-8600#!

 

[TDIMike]

Interesting thread. Since I live in a condo and don't really have room for rear speakers I wanted an acceptable solution for both music and HT. It's one of the reasons why I chose the Parasound P5, due to it's HT bypass, which allows me to keep my Marantz AVR for handling all of my video sources.

The idea of multi-channel audio is exciting for me at certain times, but for the most part music is our primary form of entertainment. Especially now that I've got the amp/preamp combo I want and my M40s have never sounded better.