Best speaker cable for CLS?

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raanan

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Hi All,this is a very confusing issue for me.I have had my CLSs for more than 19 years.They have outstayed everything else in my system by quite a margin.
I now have an ARC VS-110,with a custom tube linestage .Interconnects between pre and power are the great DPA Black Slink.
I have never heard speaker cables that gave me a feeling of reaching the sound that I am looking for.
Closest are the AZ Satori.
Also good at various stages were MIT MH750(but rolled off highs),DNM Reson(but too little bass),Audio Magic Sorcerer-a bit slow,
Totally unsuitable-XLO REF5A Series 2-everything marvelous except midrange sounds sucked out .
The Satori are the most impressive so far-but... sound a bit closed in and
seem to accentuate the upper mids/low highs-my guess-a crest at 2000-4000 cps.
Also a bit slower than the XLO.
Any advice-suggestions?Thanks.
 
I just added the Synergistic Research Designers Reference X2's with Active Shielding to my CLS setup and I'm pretty blown away. You might see if you could arrange a demo.
 
If none of the cables give you the sound for which you are looking, perhaps you are looking in the wrong area, i.e. cables; just a thought.

Have you done any room treatments ?
 
Good thinking.Of course,in the end it's all a mixture of all the changing factors.
There is quite a lot of room treatment here-Sonex at back and front walls,various Roomtunes,thick carpet,etc.,a PS 300 power conditioner and Granite 555 PCs for the CLSs.There are 2 main directions where I think I can forge ahead:Either the power tubes on the VS-110,or the speaker cables.
Raanan
 
MiTT said:
I just added the Synergistic Research Designers Reference X2's with Active Shielding to my CLS setup and I'm pretty blown away. You might see if you could arrange a demo.
Click to expand...

Thanks.Where I am,in Jerusalem,Israel-I doubt if there is any way of listening to these cables.Raanan
 
cable

just for the heck of it go out and buy a good quality 12 gauge cable Home depot, radio shack and try it you may be suprised and not broke buying that expensive stuff. there have been lots of threads on speaker cable. Doesn't Martin Logan sell speaker cable? try them.
 
i tried synergestic designer reference and it was a great cable but a little rolled off in the top end (very deep bass though) and the satori was very uninvolving (ie bland).

if you want a flat out neutral cable - would suggest xlo signature or audience
 
This is a very simple answer for cables in a setup. If you cannot hear a difference, then buy some Rad Shack or standard 14 gauge cable and be happy. If you can hear a difference between cables, then find the cable length which fits between your amp and your speakers. Next, set your budget limits. Next, find cables that you like the sound of the best. Lastly, install and sit back and enjoy the music.

All other posts here in regards to brands are just subjective opinions based on what each of us like in terms of a sound signature.
 
I couldn't agree more with what Dan has said. The only opinion that matters is your own. The only right cable is the one you like in your system playing your music. That's why I suggested a demo - the only logical way to choose is to listen to it yourself, and if you like it buy it.
 
raanan said:
Hi All,this is a very confusing issue for me.I have had my CLSs for more than 19 years.They have outstayed everything else in my system by quite a margin. I now have an ARC VS-110,with a custom tube linestage . Interconnects between pre and power are the great DPA Black Slink. I have never heard speaker cables that gave me a feeling of reaching the sound that I am looking for. Any advice-suggestions?Thanks.
Click to expand...
I've had my CLS's just as long as you. Started w/ Straightwire Maestro (still an excellent all around cable) then tried some MIT and XLO (sucked) then a pair of Straightwire Virtuoso (good but not worth the price difference from Maestro ;-) and now have Purist Audio Design Venustas which are excellent and which I will probably never replace.

You didn't say your budget, and I'm also not convinced the speaker cables are the (main) source of your dissatisfaction. I think tubes with stats are 'the answer' as everyone here knows, but the ARC house sound is typically dry, especially with electrostats. I know, because I had a pair pof ARC trioded M300 monoblocks when I first got my CLS's; later on my Levinson 23.5 SS amp sounded more rich and musical than the ARC tube amps! As for speaker cables, just make sure for starters that the capacitance is under *30pF per foot (you'd be amazed how many well respected cables are in the 200 - 300 pF range!!), and keep the speaker cable length under 12 feet if you can. Personally I do not recommend heavy duty zip cord from HD or Radio Shack becauce of it's high inductance and capacitance specs.

*Read Roger Sanders' white paper on ESL speaker cables here: http://www.sanderssoundsystems.com/Cables WP.htm
 
Ranaan, you did not specify a budget but I'm guessing you are looking for a good buy. I use Summits and recently auditioned a 1500 dollar TARA Labs cable that I bought to replace a 2800 dollar pair of Nordost (SPM Ref). It brought body to the images without losing the sense of SPACE that Nordost does so well. It is a slightly warmer presentation but all the detail seems to be there. Visit www.soundmindaudio.com and chat with Brian. Tell him tonyc sent ya'.
 
It's easy to fall into the trap of using cables as...

tone controls to compensate for colorations or weaknesses in other parts of your system. CLS' are known as the most neutral speaker there is.

If you are looking for a neutral, well-balanced, and detailed cable, I can recommend Pure Note Paragon. They are silver ribbon and a bitch to break-in (200 hours), but once broken in they are amazing; detailed, wide bandwidth, incredible staging,

Early on I went through the swapping routine Tara RSC Reference, Straightwire Maestro II, Kimber 8TC, DH Labs, Wireworld Gold Eclipse, Pure Note Cerulean, and Pure Note Paragon Enhanced. This was over the span of 15 years or so. Pure Note ribbons have a distinctive smooth natural sound with excellent texture and body, phase coherency, and deep powerful bass. The Pure Note's do this at a reasonable price. The latest Vanguards and Titaniums continue the superb Pure Note "House Sound".
I believe they still offer a full 30 day money back audition.
http://www.purenote.com

My $.02 for the day :music:

Cheers,
Ray
 
Appreciated.

Thanks,guys,for all the recommendations.
Raanan
 
Bernard said:
If none of the cables give you the sound for which you are looking, perhaps you are looking in the wrong area.
Click to expand...

Yup. Cables cannot and will not save you if something else is amiss.....

~VDR
 
Speaker cables for CLS

For a long time I had Cardas speaker cables for my CLS I's. Then NBS, which had fantastic width and solid bass. Right now I am using Crystal Cable. Granted with the Crystal Cable the bass is lighter, but to my ears they are more solid sounding with excellent details and texture.

I know quite a few people using Crystal Cables with electrostats. If I remember correctly, the owner of Crystal Cables has a pair of Summit in her office!
 
zbub said:
For a long time I had Cardas speaker cables for my CLS I's. Then NBS, which had fantastic width and solid bass. Right now I am using Crystal Cable. Granted with the Crystal Cable the bass is lighter, but to my ears they are more solid sounding with excellent details and texture. I know quite a few people using Crystal Cables with electrostats. If I remember correctly, the owner of Crystal Cables has a pair of Summit in her office!
Click to expand...
If you go to the Cardas website and look up the specs for their different speaker cables, you will see that all but two of their entry level cables have such high capacitance figures that they would never be appropriate for stats (if Roger Sanders conclusions are correct, and I think they are.)

A well-known reviewer :D used Cardas speaker cables to drive ML Summits and got bad results (too much capacitance rolled off the highs). He insisted it was the amp, later claiming he "couldn't remember" what cables he used (he "has so many"!) Guess he figures it makes no difference :rocker: Ha, ha!
 
I'm sorry, I followed that link and immediately had a 'snake-oil' alarm go off in my head.

The dude says:

This is an outstanding speaker cable design for use with Martin Logan speakers and will result in significantly clearer bass and top frequencies if you are currently using some form of seriously stranded cable like Monster. The speaker wire is 6 conductor, 14 guage each with and additional 2 strands of 18 guage if needed to carry dc voltage (Martin Logan Speakers) for the system.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but one does not transfer any signal other than Pos/Neg from an amp to the speaker. That 'dc voltage' thing and extra pair is pure BS! :mad:

You can argue stranded multi-wire vs single all you want, I’m sure there are valid reasons for either. But this useless extra pair in there will surely confuse someone, and they'll wire it wrong and fry their amp. :eek:

Me, I just ordered 175’ of BlueJeans Cable 5T00UP 10 gauge speaker wire (for panels) plus 175’ 12 gauge (for woofers), 15 banana plugs and it all came to under $315, including shipping.

The Belden cable BJC uses is very good and one of its attributes I wanted was it is UL rated and CL listed for in-wall. Since I run my cables through my crawl-space, this is a must. the Old Monster cables (shame :eek:, yes, But I bought a 500' spool when I built the house 8 years ago) have corroded in the humidity down there.

If you will be putting cables in the walls, attic or under the floor, use this type of BJC cable.
 
There are so many cables I have never heard and probably never will. However, out of the few I have tried I really like the Audience AU24 cables and interconnects followed by Harmonic Technology's Magic line.

With that said, not many system changes will have a more significant impact than improving and upgrading your room acoustics.
 
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