Why do Martin Logans have such Lousy resale value and interest?

[Mantana]

Why do Martin Logans have such lousy resale value and interest on the used market?

I had my Spires up for sale at various times along with my Montanas and
not once have had any responses on this site, Audiogon or Craigslist. I've
had a number of responses on my Montanas although no firm offers. Not
a single inquiry on the Spires..why ?? $22000 CLXs going for 12k
on the used market. Are Logans just way overpriced to begin with?
I know we have a terrible economy but i still see equipment selling on
Agon.

 

[Craig]

The resale value of Martin Logan's are right in line with most other speaker brands. Take a look at the new vs used prices of speakers on Audiogon and I think you'll see that the depreciation of MLs is consistent with other brands.

I think your asking price of $5k-ish for nearly new Spires is fair. However, limiting the sale to local buyers only is probably what's holding back any interested buyers.

 

[FISH_MAN]

this thread is a bit trollish in my opinion.

 

[eknuds01]

I would say ML has a reputation of delivering tons of bang for the buck. So I don't think the speakers are overpriced.

IMO, it's the jittery economy that is limiting the bites on potential sales. Instead of dropping 5k for speakers, most probably feel that money should be saved in the bank in case times really get tough...and for many people, times are tough.

 

[JMAUSGP]

Mantana,

You have to take into account that the economy is not just bad, it is arguably the worst it has been since the Great Depression.

That is pretty mind boggling by itself and there are some that say we are not at the bottom yet. Now that is some really scary stuff.

As for what is selling and for what, I think that the stuff you see being sold is selling because it is percieved as a really good discounted price for the product, stuff at 40 % to 50 % off retail seems to be the perceived selling point.

And with that said, the price of used Summits is such that I would think it would have a serious effect on the used price of Spires.

Or maybe not.

 

[Mantana]

I had my Spires up for sale at various times along with my Montanas and
not once have had any responses on this site, Audiogon or Craigslist. I've
had a number of responses on my Montanas although no firm offers. Not
a single inquiry on the Spires..why ?? $22000 CLXs going for 12k
on the used market. Are Logans just way overpriced to begin with?
I know we have a terrible economy but i still see equipment selling on
Agon.

I would say ML has a reputation of delivering tons of bang for the buck. So I don't think the speakers are overpriced.

IMO, it's the jittery economy that is limiting the bites on potential sales. Instead of dropping 5k for speakers, most probably feel that money should be saved in the bank in case times really get tough...and for many people, times are tough.

You're probably right, but i just noticed a 4-5 year old pair of
Magnepan 3.6s selling in about 3 days. He was asking $2900
and they retail for about $5400....not a bad deal for the
seller. I just don't see the Logans selling quickly on Agon, even
the newer speakers like the Spire and CLXs.

 

[Feltran]

I don't know exactly what the reason is, but Martin Logans seem to start selling for significantly less than MSRP almost immediately after launch. I bought my Spires new in box 8 months ago for, if I recall correctly, around $5250. If I were to sell them right now, I would expect to get $5000 for them, used.

 

[Horchem1972]

Speaker resale values.

I have always been a firm believer in never buying equipment new.If you are patient within a year or two most,you will get it for half or less.Almost all equipment is like that,not just Martin Logan products.Buying a new car is even worse.They lose 4-5 thousand dollars when you drive them off the lot.

 

[Gordon Gray]

It's just another Mantana / anti ML rant.

 

[David Matz]

I had my Spires up for sale at various times along with my Montanas and
not once have had any responses on this site, Audiogon or Craigslist. I've
had a number of responses on my Montanas although no firm offers. Not
a single inquiry on the Spires..why ?? $22000 CLXs going for 12k
on the used market. Are Logans just way overpriced to begin with?
I know we have a terrible economy but i still see equipment selling on
Agon.

Just some basic economics:

Have you compared what other brands are being discounted at? Look up Wilson, focal, B&W, Sonus F., revel, etc., and you may find similar discounts from msrp. This comparison may put things in perspective, and prove or disprove your claim.

Also, you will need to adjust the price the price by taking into account the supply of the speakers on the market at the time. Logans are popular, so there should be more of them, and thus more competition for the seller.

Additionally, the reputation of the seller should affect things also. If the reputation is shady or non-existent, the person buying deserves a further discount for taking a greater risk on the seller. Guys who sell a lot (and do it well) can ask more than the average joe.

 

[Dreamer]

The resale value depends on which owner you are. If you buy them new, the depreciation for selling used is pretty standard for any other used item--cars, TVs, boats, etc--you lose between 30%-50% right out of the chute. I think that if you're a buyer, that is a pretty good value. If you're a seller though, it sort of sucks. But just like with a car, the minute they leave the dealer, you throw away 30-50% of their pricetag...

But the re-resale valuse tends to be pretty stable with ML's, at least in my experience. The Sequels I purchased used for $1200 in the early 1990's would probably still bring between $800-1000, because they are pristine, have the original boxes and packing material, even the original manuals. And I would gladly take a 20-30% hit on them in exchange for the nearly 20 years of joy they have brought me. I think that's a fair trade...

The lack of interest with ML's is comparable to other big speakers. Most folks just don't want 6" tall speakers in the living room, and few wives will tolerate them. Compared to how fast used BOSE gear moves, you are right--used MLs sometimes take a long time to find their next owner, but compared to other speakers in their size and price range, they don't seem to sell any slower.

And the previous posts are correct with the economy issue. In a "down" economy, luxury items like speakers with a 4 or 5-digit price tag aren't going to be flying out the door, especially when they are used and don't come with any warranty.

--Richard

 

[tonepub]

If everyone wants to buy their gear used, where do speakers come from to be sold as used if no one ever bought them new?

 

[urskog]

If everyone wants to buy their gear used, where do speakers come from to be sold as used if no one ever bought them new?

From being reviewed in TONE?

 

[DrJRapp]

If everyone wants to buy their gear used, where do speakers come from to be sold as used if no one ever bought them new?

Reviewers samples, store demos, etc.....LOL.....

 

[FOUNTAIN]

If everyone wants to buy their gear used, where do speakers come from to be sold as used if no one ever bought them new?

That's a good and fair question. As for me, I try to buy new from my local dealer who is there for me when or if something goes awry. Of course, I do prefer to buy on sale or even an occasional demo from him when the opportunity arises. This way I still get his outstanding service along with a full waranty. But there have been times that I have paid full retail price for things like my cartridge, phono preamp, audio rack etc. In my experience if I buy something new with a warranty along with local support I am generally more satisfied and keep the product longer in my setup. But that does not mean I will not upgrade at certain times when funds allow and he has a good deal going on. There is nothing wrong with buying used from audiogon by no means, but this way has worked much better for my needs. As for used Martin Logans selling for cheaper than other comparable brands, I'm not so sure. While I don't look very often, they seem to hold there own against others when it comes to resale value. I may be wrong and will keep a closer look out when I am checking, but the fact that they are a somewhat unconventional speaker compared to the masses could have something to do with it. Just a thought.


Glen

 

[Rich]

Why do Martin Logans have such lousy resale value and interest on the used market?

Hmmmm? So, because you tried to sell your speakers a couple of times and couldn't, you conclude that all ML's have lousy resale and interest on the used market? Sounds like sour grapes to me.

Looking on Audiogon, ML's are holding their value very well compared to other speakers and seem to sell pretty quickly, so I don't see where you are coming from. Most speakers are going to take a 40% to 50% hit right off the bat on the used market. ML's are no different.

You mention the CLX selling for almost 50% off its new price as if that is some sort of anomaly, yet there is a pair of Magnepan 20.1's currently on the 'gon for $7,000 (originally $14,000). In other words, any comparison of similar models shows that the Logan's used value is right in line with other speaker manufacturers.

I think it seems a little silly that you use your experience only in deciding that ML's have crappy resale value and interest, when you specified "local pickup only" in your ad. That alone severely limits the amount of interest you are going to get for your speakers. You just limited your market by about 99%! And then you complain that your speakers aren't rolling out the door. Especially in a down economy. You provide no other examples than your own limited experience and from that you conclude ML's have crappy resale value and interest.

It would appear that this thread is intended more to just stir up some crap than to have an honest dialog about ML resale value.

 

[Craig]

The claim that "Martin Logans have such lousy resale value and interest on the used market" is just plain false. You have to at least compare their depreciation to other brands being offered on other sites such as Audiogon. Take a look at the Montana brand and you'll see that the asking prices are around %50 or lower on average from MSRP. There are many other examples.

Just because no one has responded to his particular for-sale ad doesn't mean they are overpriced to begin with.

 

[FISH_MAN]

You guys just can't resist can you

 

[cmos]

I had my Spires up for sale at various times along with my Montanas and
not once have had any responses on this site, Audiogon or Craigslist. I've
had a number of responses on my Montanas although no firm offers. Not
a single inquiry on the Spires..why ?? $22000 CLXs going for 12k
on the used market. Are Logans just way overpriced to begin with?
I know we have a terrible economy but i still see equipment selling on
Agon.

I would really be intersted in your speakers BUT

- I'm living in Europe
- You specified you would ship only to US
- I'm not sure Spire would accept 230V .

Second-hand Spires are still very uncommon on the european market.
Maybe worth a try, although I understand packaging might be an issue.

 

[Mantana]

Everyone makes valid points and yes even Montanas are selling for about
50% of list price. And yes my current ad does specify local pickup, but
my previous ads did not require that. Even so, i would think a new
speaker introduction such as the Spire and CLX, particularly with
the good reviews, would command a better price. I can only go
by my experience since i've run my ads locally and on Agon. I've
only had responses on the Montanas, nothing on the Spire. I've also
seen a lot of Spires, in particular, up for sale on Agon. They don't
seem to move very fast... (and Rich, you are right...i shouldn't make
a blanket statement about all Logans having poor resale value. I
really should have confined my comments to the newest Logans,
Spire, Summit X and CLX which seem to require huge discounts to
move). Another thing...i posted the Spires for sale pretty much
continuously since January (3 X on Agon and regularly on Craigslist).
Just very surprised i've received no interest on such a well known
brand name and you would think, the sweet spot of Martin Logan's
lineup.