Upgrade bug is biting

[as350_b3]

I've had my ML Odysseys since I bought them new in 2006. Everything else in my system has been changed multiple times, however the speakers were always the anker in my audio adventures. Recently I've listened to a demo set of KEF Blade One speakers and I was smitten by the sound. They were very fast and precise, but also very musical and beautiful. I'm seriously contemplating replacing my MLs with the Blade speakers. Does anyone here have experience with the KEF Blades and can give an opinion on longterm pros/cons?

 

[Tosh]

Go active xo on the bass, and you'll discover quick tuneful low bass from those Odysseys.

 

[as350_b3]

I'm bi-amping the Odysseys using Krell FPB-350mcx monoblocks, so I have plenty of bottom end. How much more would an active x-over get me?

 

[Russr]

I'm bi-amping the Odysseys using Krell FPB-350mcx monoblocks, so I have plenty of bottom end. How much more would an active x-over get me?

When you say "Bi-amping", could you give some more detail on your configuration? Do you have 4 X Krell 350's? If so, how are you splitting the frequencies between amplification channels?

Thanks

 

[as350_b3]

I currently don't have a digital active x-over, so my preamp is feeding a single signal to the monobloc, which has 2 separate outputs. I run 2 speaker cables from each output to 2 separate sets of binding posts on each speaker. So no x-over other than the ML built in electronics.

 

[Brandon Hartwick]

Active crossovers on the bass make a pretty dramatic difference since it really cleans up the overlap between the panel and the woofer. It sounds substantially better, right away.

Did you end up going with the Blades?

 

[Doug033]

I currently don't have a digital active x-over, so my preamp is feeding a single signal to the monobloc, which has 2 separate outputs. I run 2 speaker cables from each output to 2 separate sets of binding posts on each speaker. So no x-over other than the ML built in electronics.

The Jl Audio CR-1 has transformed my system: ML CLS 1 + 2 JL Fathom 110 V2’s. Crossover at 80hz, 24 db/octave. Better bass, more detailed mids, wider soundstage, and the speakers completely disappear. The subs handle the bass fundamentals and the visceral punch, while the panels handle the snap from percussive instruments and, of course, all the vocal and instrumental detail.

 

[Brandon Hartwick]

I currently don't have a digital active x-over, so my preamp is feeding a single signal to the monobloc, which has 2 separate outputs. I run 2 speaker cables from each output to 2 separate sets of binding posts on each speaker. So no x-over other than the ML built in electronics.

That bi-wiring, not bi-amping. Inside each amplifier is a single set of outputs with 2 sets of binding posts linked together.

 

[as350_b3]

I haven't made a decision on the Blades yet - I move at a glacial pace, lol. I'll have to research active x-over a bit more, thanks for the tip.

 

[Heyfey]

The Jl Audio CR-1 has transformed my system: ML CLS 1 + 2 JL Fathom 110 V2’s. Crossover at 80hz, 24 db/octave. Better bass, more detailed mids, wider soundstage, and the speakers completely disappear. The subs handle the bass fundamentals and the visceral punch, while the panels handle the snap from percussive instruments and, of course, all the vocal and instrumental detail.

I too have a JL Audio CR-1 subwoofer crossover and couldn't agree more, it's a great, very flexible piece of gear. My Odysseys had a big bump at about 50 Hz. that the JL has allowed me to completely eliminate, and I can't hear any diminished quality coming from the Odysseys. I always thought it would be perfect for a CLS/Z/X based system, and Doug seemed to confirm that.

 

[Tosh]

I'm bi-amping the Odysseys using Krell FPB-350mcx monoblocks, so I have plenty of bottom end. How much more would an active x-over get me?

Two years ago I encouraged @DanR to upgrade his Odysseys to active xo bass, and he was very pleased. I hope @DanR chimes in!

 

[DanR]

Two years ago I encouraged @DanR to upgrade his Odysseys to active xo bass, and he was very pleased. I hope @DanR chimes in!

Wow has that been two years already time flies. As for the odysseys yep still have them and they still sound fabulous. Once I converted them to active crossover on the woofers. The bass integrated far better than with the passive crossovers that ML uses. And that was always my major complaint with that era of ML hybrids, and they’ve FINALLY come around with the Masterpiece series but I will not pay that ridiculous price for them. After I switched over to active crossover on the woofers I took it a step further and played around with replacing both woofers on the Odysseys with drivers of my liking (there are plenty of options out there for those too). So yep I couldn’t be more satisfied with the Odysseys done right like ML should have done in the first place years ago.

 

[Brandon Hartwick]

You need to remember that the panel is a line source and the woofer is a point source so both of these behave differently depending on the distance.

As a test, disconnect the woofers and play only the panels. Stand in front of the panel and slowly walk towards the back of the room, then do the same with the woofers. Depending on the distance you stand the sound balance will change dramatically when running both together making bi-amplification with level adjustment very important. The steeper slope on the active Xover helps the woofer to stop bleeding so deep into the frequencies the panel is playing.

 

[gvera]

You need to remember that the panel is a line source and the woofer is a point source so both of these behave differently depending on the distance.

As a test, disconnect the woofers and play only the panels. Stand in front of the panel and slowly walk towards the back of the room, then do the same with the woofers. Depending on the distance you stand the sound balance will change dramatically when running both together making bi-amplification with level adjustment very important. The steeper slope on the active Xover helps the woofer to stop bleeding so deep into the frequencies the panel is playing.

When I bought mi Odysseys (more than 20 years ago) I was aware of that difference in behaviour and was curious to know how ML factor that in their designs.
I was lucky and the question was answered directly by Joe Vojtko, he stated that room interaction mitigated that difference and that the Odysseys were designed assuming a 3m listening distance, at wich panel/woofer level would match in a typical room.

 

[Brandon Hartwick]

was lucky and the question was answered directly by Joe Vojtko, he stated that room interaction mitigated that difference and that the Odysseys were designed assuming a 3m listening distance, at wich panel/woofer level would match in a typical room.

I had always assumed they designed these with a specific listening distance in mind. With level controls and active X overs you can make them work at any listening distance.