System #184 (Summit)

[Shoe]

Good to be part of this great site:

1) Name: Sam

2) Location: Snohomish, WA. (20 miles NE of Seattle)

3) ML model: Summit (previous owned Vantage, Arius i/ SL3)

4) Purchase: July 2006

5) Mod's/ changes: none

6) Associated Electronics: Naim CDX/XPS CD player, Music Hall MMF-7
turntable, Phonomena phono preamp, Conrad Johnson 17LS,CJ 2500 soild state amp, Rel Stratta III

Shunyata power cords, Audio Quest Gibraltar speaker wire. Dedicated power lines for digital and amps.

The ML experience: I have been in audio over the last thirty years in which the last ten years I have own ML speakers. The Vantage in my view
eliminates most of the weakness that has plague ML speakers of the past models ( you know what they were) Now with the Vantage and the Summits there is a seamless presentation from top to bottom; neutrality and timber is "world class". The marriage between the Vantage and the Mac 275 is the "real" sounding combo I have ever experience. I listen 2-4 hours almost everyday that is never boring, no listener fatiuge,but continues to bring an emotional pack experience with each listening session.
I have built my dedicated room from the start and all the acoustical panels, bass traps, except for the diffusion panels. It has been a labor of love and a learning experience. I believe that the room is the most important component in one's system that can make it or break it for great sound.
Thanks for all the great post that all of you contribute on this site. I am looking forward in being apart of the ML family. Sam

 

[Pcar928fan]

VERY NICE set up! Welcome to the family online! We are always glad to have a new member join the club, or come to the asylum as it were!

We are a fun group here with a vast and diverse amount of experience. You have been at this a long time and I hope you will share your wisdom and knowledge with those of us still learning and growing in this hobby! :cheers:

 

[Joey_V]

Asylum... welcome to your jail cell!

Seriously, :welcome: and join in on the festivities!

 

[Dreamer]

Welcome! You hav a really nice-looking system. I've been lusting over the Mac 275 for years, but have yet to get one.

Glad to see another "tweeker" on the site (I noticed your cable elevators, and the amp stand looks homemade--care to give us the details? It looks like you used the same 18"x18" travertine tiles that I have under my Carvers, but what is that black puck under the amp?)

Anyway, welcome, and congrats on putting together such a fine-looking system!
--Richard

 

[TomDac]

Welcome aboard, Sam!!

 

[twich54]

Sam, Welcome ! Glad to have another viynl 'junkie' in the group !
Fine looking system you've assembled.

 

[Rich]

Sam,

Welcome to the club! You have a very nice looking (and sounding, I'm sure) setup. You are so right about the importance of the room and room treatments to the sound of the system. Along those lines, I love the look of your diffusion panels. Where did you acquire them? I think it is great you made all of your other acoustic treatments. That just makes the great sound that much more satisfying, doesn't it?

 

[philox]

Sam, I love to see systems with all out acoustics. Way to go. I always wanted to hear a Phonomena phono preamp. What is your upgrade vision?

 

[kcl]

Great looking system! Glad to have you aboard!

 

[Shoe]

Ken thanks for response. You are correct in your observation regarding the travertine that’s under the amp. I flip a house last summer where I used the tile throughout the kitchen and had some extras left over. The plucks that I am using I bought from a local dealer in Seattle that is no longer in business. I can’t for the life of me remember what they are called. They are four inches in diameter with a rubber pad that is attach to one side of the metal disk and a removable pad that is recess on the other side. They work really well. I have three of them between the tile and the floor, then three between the two tiles, then three under the amp. I know it is overkill but I wanted to insure a vibration free environment for the tubes. Sam

 

[Shoe]

Rich the diffusion panels are from Acoustical first. You can go to there web site and check them out. (www’ acousicalfirst.com) They are made out of plastic but very sturdy. I find them to work quite well as they are design to diffuse around the 250 mega hertz where the midrange exist. Having them on the front wall does a nice job in breaking up the back wave thus opening up the soundstage where the music seems to emulate from the front of the plane of the speakers to beyond the back wall and the side walls. This really creates a multiple layers of sound that gives you the great sense of depth. Not what you often can get often refer to the “curtain effect” where sound is primarily coming from a straight line between the speakers. Then of course having the diffusion panels behind me helps to create an envelope sound field that gives a greater sense that you are in concert hall or a small intimate night club. All I can say is that they really work and I could not listen to music without them. By the way, for them to do what they were design to do they need to be placed at least ten feet from the listener. Sam

 

[Robin]

Fantastic Vantage / McIntosh System...

Sam,

Welcome to the ML Club!

Wow! Your deticated listening room looks wonderful! :drool:

I especially am interested in your pairing of the McIntosh MC275 with your Vantages, as I am concidering doing the same thing with a future system, I am planning for my bedroom. Does the musical tubed sound of the Mc275 impart the real emotional impact to the music? Does it have enough power to give the depth of sound stage and sweet smoothness to each note of music? Please discribe it for me (us) in more detail..., as I would really appreciate knowing just what this pairing gives to the sound the Vantages produce?

It is good to have you here.

 

[Shoe]

Regarding Mc 275

Thanks Robin for your kind words. First of all let me say that I can’t overly express how important the room is in having good sound. I think a lot of people pay lip service to acknowledging that fact, but continue to put much of their hard earn money in component upgrades that give marginal benefits. I know from personal experience; I have spent hundreds and thousands of dollars in trying to obtain musical satisfaction, but always ended up not enjoying the music. That all change when I realize that my current room was “audio challenged” it was beyond hope. Due impart to room dimension, widows and playing double duty as a family room. I was just about ready to throw in the towel, when I realized that I had this separate hen house that was 40’ long that was serving no real purpose. That was the beginning of an incredible adventure that gave me the musical experience that my soul was longing for. The rest is history which is to say that the heart of my system is the room. I no longer tweak or upgrade the components; I continue to tweak the room as I continue to grow in understanding the dynamics of acoustics.

To your question regarding the Mc275, it is all that you suggested and more. I believe that the synergy between the 275/Vantage is something very special and one of the best kept secrets out there in audio land. To be honest Robin it’s hard for me to stop listening, it is that magnetic. I have never had a system the draws me into the music than the Mc. The soundstage, imagine, air and separation is all there, but what captures me more than anything is how convincing the music is presented top too bottom and the fact that the music sounds so real. Those are attributes that matters to me.

A couple of months ago Ken Kessler in Hi Fi News reviewed the Vantage and simply stated that the speaker is world class, and sounds best with tubes. Guess what? The tube amp he used was no other the Mc 275. You owe it to your self to check it out. Remember the bottom line is the room. Sam

 

[tonyc]

Welcome Sam! What an immaculate setup. Like you I have discovered the importance of room treatment but you are much further along than I. I see you are using a Shunyata Hydra and powercords. I am using their powercords and I am considering a power conditioner to replace my now long in the tooth Monster HTPS 7000. Do you think the Hydra is worth the considerable expense and does it make that big a difference?

 

[Robin]

Brilliant!

Thanks Robin for your kind words. First of all let me say that I can’t overly express how important the room is in having good sound. I think a lot of people pay lip service to acknowledging that fact, but continue to put much of their hard earn money in component upgrades that give marginal benefits. I know from personal experience; I have spent hundreds and thousands of dollars in trying to obtain musical satisfaction, but always ended up not enjoying the music. That all change when I realize that my current room was “audio challenged” it was beyond hope. Due impart to room dimension, widows and playing double duty as a family room. I was just about ready to throw in the towel, when I realized that I had this separate hen house that was 40’ long that was serving no real purpose. That was the beginning of an incredible adventure that gave me the musical experience that my soul was longing for. The rest is history which is to say that the heart of my system is the room. I no longer tweak or upgrade the components; I continue to tweak the room as I continue to grow in understanding the dynamics of acoustics.

To your question regarding the Mc275, it is all that you suggested and more. I believe that the synergy between the 275/Vantage is something very special and one of the best kept secrets out there in audio land. To be honest Robin it’s hard for me to stop listening, it is that magnetic. I have never had a system the draws me into the music than the Mc. The soundstage, imagine, air and separation is all there, but what captures me more than anything is how convincing the music is presented top too bottom and the fact that the music sounds so real. Those are attributes that matters to me.

A couple of months ago Ken Kessler in Hi Fi News reviewed the Vantage and simply stated that the speaker is world class, and sounds best with tubes. Guess what? The tube amp he used was no other the Mc 275. You owe it to your self to check it out. Remember the bottom line is the room. Sam

Sam,

Excellent!
Thank you so much for your wonderful detailed description. I shall read Ken Kessler's review as well. I appreciate your assistance as I am considering the MC275 Mk VI ~ with Summits or Super Summits or CLX / Descent i...

Thanks again... :cheers:

 

[Robin]

Lovely Review of Vantage and McIntosh MC275...

Sam,

I just found and read this article it's just great. Thanks again for the recommendation...



http://www.tr.martinlogan.com/reviews/summit_hifi_news.html



All Vantage owners should read this as required reading...

 

[Shoe]

Hydra 8

Welcome Sam! What an immaculate setup. Like you I have discovered the importance of room treatment but you are much further along than I. I see you are using a Shunyata Hydra and powercords. I am using their powercords and I am considering a power conditioner to replace my now long in the tooth Monster HTPS 7000. Do you think the Hydra is worth the considerable expense and does it make that big a difference?

I really like the Hydra (your right it is a lot of money) When I bought the Hydra, I thought I would try it with the thought that it would have to make a dramatic difference to justify the price. This was two years ago, and as you can see I was impress. Not that it made a huge difference; it did not add any thing like coloration nor take away any dynamics. What it did right convince me to keep it. First thing I notice was a lowering of the noise floor. This caused the music to appear out of no where; which allowed me to hear deeper into the music. The second thing that I notice over a short period of time was how the music was more relax. I don’t know if this makes sense to you, but the music seemed better organized when the Hydra was in the system. These enhancement in my view was well worth the expense, plus the add assurance that my equipment was protected.

I would highly recommend that you first put in a dedicated AC line (at least two) to power your components, with a good ground. I believe that should come first if that is practical for you to do. Regarding the Hydra being plug into amps, I have had mix results. When I had the CJ 2500 amp the Hydra did not affect its performance, if any thing it was better. But with the Mc 275 I find that the hydra diminishes the dynamics. Therefore I plug it directly into a dedicated line. Every thing else in my system is plugged into the Hydra. I hope I have provided some helpful info for you. Keep in mind that power conditioners performance will vary greatly from one environment to another. If all possible try to demo one before you commit, or buy one on the used market and if you do not like you should be able to resell it with no risk; they are very popular.

Sam

 

[Shoe]

System #184 Revesion

I am updating a couple of upgrades that were will worth the time and money; as well tweaking the room. The payoff was without doubt most satisfying. I upgraded the preamp from a CJ Premire 10 the CJ 17 LS. Gave me greater detail and better micro and macro detail. I went from the Mac 275 to a CJ 2500 mf solid state, which gave me greater impact on transits through out musical band. Than the biggest upgrade was the Summits that replace the Vantages. Although very similar in sound, the Summits provided deeper realistic bass, more detail into the music that is more involving. Deeper sound stage push way back in the far corners of the room where the instruments still maintain their own space. The last upgrade was trying to find the right balance in treating the front wall with absorption and diffusion. I believe I have archived that balance as you can see from the picture. Thanks for allowing me to share my passion for music and for being a layman in dealing with acoustic; It's a lot of fun and rewarding. Sam

 

[amey01]

Wow - how did I miss this?

 

[Jeff Zaret]

Shoe/Sam,
Great looking setup.
I did have the CJ 2500 amp and it was great and I think at the same time I also have the CJ Premier 17LS and then upgraded to the 17 LS2. It is a great combination enjoy the sound it is truly engaging in its overall presentation and detail.

BTW, I am selling my 17LS2.

Jeff