RealTraps

[Gordon]

As some of you may know, I have had 2 HF minis up behind my speakers for the past week or so. I'm very pleased with the results so far.

My youngest son walks (finally) next Saturday. So, there are no more college expenses for me. You'd think after 4 I'd be living in a cardboard box with a transistor radio for music!! I digress, sorry.

I was reading the long thread (again) JonFo started about improving his room with traps. I picked up on the fact we do not want to use Mondo's behind the speakers due to it's reflective properties. Placement should be in the corners. The outside edge of my HF minis are only 12 inches from the corner and I cannot put the Mondos in the corners. My speakers are about 6' 6" apart and I sit about 12 foot back.

Real Traps offer the Tri-corners and I'm wondering how effective they would be in relation to the Mondos. I know I need the bass traps and am considering starting with 2 tricorners for the floor and a GIK 244? centered near the floor.

Any thoughts?

If not, I'll give Ethan a call on Monday.

Gordon

 

[Rich]

I have eight tri-corners and four corner-mondos, and the bass response is incredible.

But I didn't listen to it with just the tri-corners installed so can't help you too much with that comparison. Basically, bass trapping is a cumulative thing. It is hard to have too much and some is much better than none. So start with the tri-corners and then go from there. Also, if you can't fit corner mondos in the front of your room, how about the back corners? Just a thought.

Definitely give Ethan a call and get his opinion.

 

[Ethan Winer]

Gordon, you're always welcome to call for my advice. As Rich said, bass trapping is cumulative so the more you have, the flatter and tighter the bass will be. It's that simple.

I didn't listen to it with just the tri-corners installed ... So start with the tri-corners and then go from there.

Tri-Corner traps do a fine job on their own, and even two of them made a very real improvement in Kal Rubinson's nearly square room when he reviewed them for Stereophile magazine. Our intent with Tri-Corners is mainly for rooms where having large bass traps straddling corners is not "allowed." But using both types together is better still - MondoTraps straddling, with Tri-Corners below and/or above.

if you can't fit corner mondos in the front of your room, how about the back corners?

Yes, all corners are viable. Even when the room is very long and the rear wall is 30 feet away, traps back there still help a lot. And remember that most rooms have 12 corners, not just four.

--Ethan

 

[benleeys]

...... I picked up on the fact we do not want to use Mondo's behind the speakers due to it's reflective properties.

Gordon,
The Mondo has a HF version which is non-reflective and absorbs more bass. It's taller than the Mini and fits nicely behind my Summits. I use the Mini HF for 1st reflections.

 

[attyonline]

Yes, all corners are viable. Even when the room is very long and the rear wall is 30 feet away, traps back there still help a lot. And remember that most rooms have 12 corners, not just four.

--Ethan[/QUOTE]

Ok I will bite. My room has 8 corners I think. 12??

 

[zaphod]

Yes, all corners are viable. Even when the room is very long and the rear wall is 30 feet away, traps back there still help a lot. And remember that most rooms have 12 corners, not just four.

--Ethan

Ok I will bite. My room has 8 corners I think. 12??

yeah, i count 8 as well. and i counted twice. with pen and paper. and i took my shoes off in case i got above 10. but only 8.

c'mon Uncle Ethan, where'dja hide the other four

 

[ralflar]

4 x tri-corners = 12 corners

 

[Rich]

Corner (noun) - a place or angle where two or more sides or edges meet.

You guys are assuming corner means a tri-corner. Bass accumulates in ceiling/wall and floor/wall corners as well, and all of these can be treated with bass traps. Thus, there are four ceiling/wall corners, four floor/wall corners, and four wall/wall corners (for a total of twelve), plus eight tri-corners, that can be treated.

 

[tonepub]

Adding bass traps to my room was the best improvement for the money I've ever heard....

 

[Ethan Winer]

there are four ceiling/wall corners, four floor/wall corners, and four wall/wall corners (for a total of twelve)

Exactly - I wasn't even considering tri-corners.

--Ethan

 

[attyonline]

Why would you treat the midwall junction on each wall? I thought bass was the weakest at the midpoint of each wall??

 

[Rich]

Why would you treat the midwall junction on each wall? I thought bass was the weakest at the midpoint of each wall??

Actually, "where the bass is weakest" will vary with the dimensions of each room. What we are saying is that bass, because of its nature, accumulates in all corners. By that I mean that the wave expands until it is forced into the corner and then it reflects back out of the corner, which is why treating the corners is effective. You absorb it on the way in and the way out.

Each corner (i.e. floor/wall corner or floor/ceiling corner) stretches from one end of the room to the other and you can treat it anywhere along that stretch. Wall/wall corners stretch from floor to ceiling and can be treated anywhere along that stretch. Obviously, some points will be more effective than others but this varies for the unique dimensions of each room and also depending on speaker placement. Tri-corners are always very effective to treat because they tend to get the most accumulation of bass waves.

 

[Ethan Winer]

Why would you treat the midwall junction on each wall? I thought bass was the weakest at the midpoint of each wall??

Rich gave you the right answer about bass accumulating in corners. I'll add that bass waves travel all over, and bounce off everything. What waves go where depends on the room size and shape, the speaker placement, and the frequency being considered. Yes, some places are generally better than others for bass traps, and most people are not willing to put 45 traps in their living room as I've done. Related, this short article and free pink noise download help find where a small number of bass traps should be placed to get the maximum benefit:

http://www.realtraps.com/lf-noise.htm

Also, the entire rear wall behind you is a good candidate for bass trapping, independent of everything else.

--Ethan

 

[Gordon]

I ordered 2 Tri-corners and got them on Thursday. I put them in the front on the floor, the wife is not to sure about them up on the ceiling, yet. I did have to go to Lowes and buy some rubber dots to help keep the traps from sliding down on the wood floor and a couple dots on the top to prevent wall damage.

I really did not think these small traps would make that big of an impact. I was wrong. The bass has tightened up tremendously. I'm beginning to hear multiple bass notes finally. The room still needs more work, but the progress is very pleasing.

I'm starting to think I jumped the gun on buying the sub before the traps. I've tried both ways and the sub in my opinion is only very slightly affecting the presentation. I'm still playing with positioning but my options are limited by some of the furniture in the room.

Gordon

 

[Rich]

I really did not think these small traps would make that big of an impact. I was wrong.

And so it begins . . .

(Remember, the effects are cumulative. The more you add, the better it gets.)