slowGEEZR
Well-known member
Ok. What happens to the input power when an amp is biwired to the Summits? The subwoofer is already powered by its own amp, so does the extra input power get redirected to the panels?
Powered subwoofers and biwiring...
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DTB300
Well-known member
I don't own Summits but I thought in a previous thread someone stated that ML does not recommend Bi-Amping the Summits. I am sure one of the "Joey Summit Clan" will jump in here to confirm. 
Dan
Dan
Total waste to bi-wire the Summits, they use the signal to drive a high-Z matching circuit to feed the low-pass crossover, which then feeds the amp inside the summit. Feeding the speaker with another set of wires does absolutely nothing to improve the situation.
slowGEEZR
Well-known member
So, the high-Z matching circuit feeds the low-pass crossover a reduced strength signal (line level)? Or is the the high strength (assuming 150 watts coming from the amp) signal fed to the crossover? What happens to the 150 watts the amplifier sent in? I'm assumming all 150 watts are sent to the panels via the crossover, but I'm a little confused in that my understanding of the crossover was to separate frequency; lows to the subs, rest to the panels. Also, if the two terminal posts for the subwoofer are past the crossover, how does the power fed to them get to the panel?
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slowGEEZR
Well-known member
The biwire connectors connect to the crossover at different points, where I must assume, all input power is directed to the panels, while the incoming frequencies go to their corresponding speaker segments (subs or panels). I had made the incorrect assumption that the crossover was only accessed via the top input binding posts.
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socialxray
Well-known member
When you bi-wire you do not gain another 150 watts. You just feed the signal to a different point in the crossover. I doubt that you are losing anything but nothing is redirected to the panels either. Some manufactures even discourage bi-wiring since it is of dubious value. Of course it does sale more cable so you will never hear that at a stereo shop.
paulo m
Well-known member
Actually, John McDonald of Audience advised against it when I mentioned my interest in biwiring with their Au24. It goes to show that some are more honest than others...
Pcar928fan
Well-known member
I just read an article in TAS and they noted how a particular speaker sounded much better after doing it... Well, they might have been bi-AMPing, not wiring. Sorry... I thought I have ready where they bi-wired though and liked the sound better.
I think it is probably iffy at best as to if it produces better sound. Seems dubious to me...always has.
slowGEEZR
Well-known member
If an amplifier is hooked up to the speaker in biwire mode, then its power must be directed somewhere. I'm not talking about gaining an extra 150 watts, I'm talking about inputting 150 watts to the speaker, biwired. The subwoofer has its own power (I think 200 watts in the Summits). My question was, what happens to the 150 watts when it is applied. I think the 150 watts from my amp would go to the panels, as the subs are already powered. I think the crossover only sends the low frequencies to the sub amp, not the power.
Pcar928fan
Well-known member
I recall a question like that when looking at the set up with REL subs and I was told that the sub is INVISIBLE to the amp because its resistance is so high. I am no EE, but that makes it sound like it is pulling just a touch of the signal and amplifying that on its own, thus leaving 99.999% of the power of the amp to go to whatever else it is hooked up to. If that is the way the amp "sees" the sub in a Summit, etc. then ALL of your amps power is being used on the panel and virtually NONE on the sub. That seems to me as if it would make no difference in how the sub part of a summit would sound no matter the wiring or the amp connected to the speaker.... YMMV...
The high impedance section of the input will take a tiny part of the input signal, on the order of a volt or two (long ago I knew the formula for this but no longer) and direct it to the input of the amp inside the Summit. Very little of the signal is lost with this method of drive though one could theoretically argue that the circuit could affect the signal sent on to the panels.
Pcar928fan
Well-known member
Just what I was trying to say, but put MUCH, MUCH better than I ever could have put it! Thanks for clearing it up...
slowGEEZR
Well-known member
Thanks! This question had been bugging me, but no more! - Steve
paulo m
Well-known member
I have my Vantages biwired. When I was breaking them in I used a recording of sea waves breaking and had my cables in single wire mode. During that process I distinctly heard a subtle continuous phasing effect. When I removed the jumper clips and biwired the speakers, the effect vanished. From that point onwards, I never went back to single wire.
