Tom's acoustic panel link
- Thread starter wink
- Start date
Help Support MartinLogan Audio Owners Forum:
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
THANKS!!! This is awesome.
You're welcome! Had to go two years back into my paypal Acct to find the direct link...lol!
BTW, I put them up with double-sided tape and T-pins. I figured that question would come up eventually...
Dan
Cool looking little blocks.
But I would be remiss if I did not point out the open cell foam placed directly on the wall only absorbs high frequencies.
Electrostats benefit from absorbers that are effective down to 250Hz (or lower, but those would be huge), which is why the typical absorber to use is something along the specs of a RealTraps MiniTraps HF (HF = High-frequency, it does not have a 'limp mass' element that could reflect HF) — and spaced by two or three inches from the wall for best lower-frequency absorption.
By going lower, you can mitigate the dipole cancelation and get improvements in the lower range of the ESL. And by being a broader band absorber, it does not skew the balance as much as one that only di low-end or only high-end.
But I would be remiss if I did not point out the open cell foam placed directly on the wall only absorbs high frequencies.
Electrostats benefit from absorbers that are effective down to 250Hz (or lower, but those would be huge), which is why the typical absorber to use is something along the specs of a RealTraps MiniTraps HF (HF = High-frequency, it does not have a 'limp mass' element that could reflect HF) — and spaced by two or three inches from the wall for best lower-frequency absorption.
By going lower, you can mitigate the dipole cancelation and get improvements in the lower range of the ESL. And by being a broader band absorber, it does not skew the balance as much as one that only di low-end or only high-end.
Last edited:
Thanks, Jonathan. When I originally purchased these absorbers my speakers were really close to the wall, maybe 3 feet. Now, over the last year I've creeped them out another foot or so. I need to have someone come in and tune my room properly. Room acoustics is one thing I've never really had a grasp on. I plan on holding on to this setup for awhile, so I would like to get the room tuned correctly(WAF taken into consideration, of course)
Dan
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
OK.. just an update.. After doing tons of research, I just placed an order for this: https://www.acoustimac.com/wp-stagger/
Went with Orange and Gray, as my living room has lots of orange in it.. Will start here on the left wall and see what differences I can hear. Perhaps some other stuff down the road for corners (bass traps). What I'm most trying to solve is the echo in the room.. Fingers crossed and I'll post then they arrive and I get them installed.
Went with Orange and Gray, as my living room has lots of orange in it.. Will start here on the left wall and see what differences I can hear. Perhaps some other stuff down the road for corners (bass traps). What I'm most trying to solve is the echo in the room.. Fingers crossed and I'll post then they arrive and I get them installed.
Hey Tom, congrats! those look sharp
These should definetly help with echo-related issues. Can you diagram (pencil on napking is fine) your room in general terms, might have some suggestions on placements.
Are the walls stucco or drywall?
Cheers
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
Here's a video I took of the room.. I sent this to a company (not Acoustimac) to get their thoughts on what I should do..
https://youtu.be/4xmzZQypaaw
They sent me back some diagrams and a price for all they suggested. It was about $750 for all of it, but I wan't a fan of their color choices.. Acoustimac seemed to have way more options in that regard and liked what i saw on their website. These panels I just bought will be for the wall to the left of the fireplace where the orange painting is..
https://youtu.be/4xmzZQypaaw
They sent me back some diagrams and a price for all they suggested. It was about $750 for all of it, but I wan't a fan of their color choices.. Acoustimac seemed to have way more options in that regard and liked what i saw on their website. These panels I just bought will be for the wall to the left of the fireplace where the orange painting is..
Last edited:
Thanks Tom, it is helpful to see that.
So here are the recommendations :
Yes, placing your new treatments along the left wall will definitely help. Make sure the lower portion of all the units are no higher than the woofer of the Kef's. If you plan to keep the existing painting (nice one), then mounting those panels should all wind up at the correct heights.
Next, I'd suggest dealing with the wall and glass doors opposite with something that would balance out the absorption and give you some light control. So I suggest mounting a dual-bar curtain rod and placing block-out curtains on the inner-bar, and something you like decor-wise on the outer side. Just make it as heavy and acoustically absorbent a material as possible while still being something livable.
When all that is closed, you will have much-improved light control for TV viewing, as well as a more balanced side-to-side acoustic performance.
Ideally, any lateral echo will go away with that.
Now, I see a really clear problem area acoustically with that 'wall' just behind the sofa. In spite of the big opening, the problem is you have a hard surface, at ear level reflecting the sound right back at you. Additionally, it creates some likely bass modes, but given how open everything is around that structure, possibly not a big deal. Would need to see a REW sample or two to determine that.
So at a minimum, place 2" absorbers just below the sill of the opening such that no reflective surface is available to return sound to listeners ears.
One or two of these 48" x 12" would do the trick: https://www.acoustimac.com/dmd-412-acoustic-panels/ Two (if they fit) would be best.
A good next step would be to similarly treat the vertical sections of the walls around the opening.
Another source of reflections is the nice, shiny leather couch. So for critical listening, drape a nice quilt or similar thick blanket material over the back of the sofa. You'll be surprised at the difference just that can make.
Finally, that fake plant in the corner is doing nothing acoustically, so if you have some bass modes you need to control, some nice RealTraps corner-traps would fix that. But measure first. Do you have REW or other measuring rig?
I hope that helps.
So here are the recommendations :
Yes, placing your new treatments along the left wall will definitely help. Make sure the lower portion of all the units are no higher than the woofer of the Kef's. If you plan to keep the existing painting (nice one), then mounting those panels should all wind up at the correct heights.
Next, I'd suggest dealing with the wall and glass doors opposite with something that would balance out the absorption and give you some light control. So I suggest mounting a dual-bar curtain rod and placing block-out curtains on the inner-bar, and something you like decor-wise on the outer side. Just make it as heavy and acoustically absorbent a material as possible while still being something livable.
When all that is closed, you will have much-improved light control for TV viewing, as well as a more balanced side-to-side acoustic performance.
Ideally, any lateral echo will go away with that.
Now, I see a really clear problem area acoustically with that 'wall' just behind the sofa. In spite of the big opening, the problem is you have a hard surface, at ear level reflecting the sound right back at you. Additionally, it creates some likely bass modes, but given how open everything is around that structure, possibly not a big deal. Would need to see a REW sample or two to determine that.
So at a minimum, place 2" absorbers just below the sill of the opening such that no reflective surface is available to return sound to listeners ears.
One or two of these 48" x 12" would do the trick: https://www.acoustimac.com/dmd-412-acoustic-panels/ Two (if they fit) would be best.
A good next step would be to similarly treat the vertical sections of the walls around the opening.
Another source of reflections is the nice, shiny leather couch. So for critical listening, drape a nice quilt or similar thick blanket material over the back of the sofa. You'll be surprised at the difference just that can make.
Finally, that fake plant in the corner is doing nothing acoustically, so if you have some bass modes you need to control, some nice RealTraps corner-traps would fix that. But measure first. Do you have REW or other measuring rig?
I hope that helps.
Last edited:
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
Thanks for the insight, Jon... Drapes for the sliders are not in the cards, unfortunately... Once i get this wall taken care of, I think some bass traps might be next.. We'll see what my budget allows.
RDC
Well-known member
Beautiful home Tom. Instead of drapes you might want to consider something like a foldable room divider principle. With, or made of, some absorption panels. Easy to put aside or in storage. Just a thought...
sleepysurf
Well-known member
Tom, how about a heavy fabric shade with blackout lining, along the lines of... https://www.selectblinds.com/rollershades/modern-elements-blackout-roller-shades.html Just roll them down as needed for serious listening.
That's what I currently have for the slider on the left side of my family/listening room. It's not perfect, but does tame some of the higher frequency side reflections, which is more of an issue for your dynamic speakers (vs. ML's).
We're in the process of re-decorating our room, and my wife agreed to let me add full width lined drapes, as long as she picks out the fabric. That should improve my acoustics a bit more.
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
guess what arrived today?
Went with a beveled edge:
Here's the wall they will go on:
Firstly, I must say that the build quality of these is EXCELLENT. Very well done! Will post more pics as I install.
Went with a beveled edge:
Here's the wall they will go on:
Firstly, I must say that the build quality of these is EXCELLENT. Very well done! Will post more pics as I install.
Last edited:
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
I've been listening to music most of the day.. BIG difference with the acoustic panels installed. Much less echo and the imaging is more focused. This is a good step in the right direction. More coming down the road.
Tom, that is great to see and hear. Nice job on the installation!
Acoustically treating a room is quite transformational, and can really make listening sessions much more pleasurable.
I look forward to hearing / seeing more as your room treatment journey continues.
Acoustically treating a room is quite transformational, and can really make listening sessions much more pleasurable.
I look forward to hearing / seeing more as your room treatment journey continues.
Wow. That is a challenge!! Can’t even imagine dipoles in that room. Haha.
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
Yeah.. Now some of you guys may understand why I sold my Summits.
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
I've installed 3 more acoustic panels... two on the wall the sofa sits on and another between the two sliding doors. Same company (Acoustimac). 3ft high.. 2 ft wide. 2" rock wool.
WOW. I'm sitting in the sweet spot... WOW.. i just listened to Jon Anderson's "State Of Independence" from his 1994 CD "Change We Must" and it gave me goosebumps and almost brought me to tears.
WOW. I'm sitting in the sweet spot... WOW.. i just listened to Jon Anderson's "State Of Independence" from his 1994 CD "Change We Must" and it gave me goosebumps and almost brought me to tears.
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
Very cool. Time to look into some 13a’s.
ha ha.. NO.
