Thoughts on the Quad 2905?

[Bernard]

Hi Bernard,

I don't think for a second that Peter Walker was the font of all knowledge with regard to audio but his comment about a window on the music has a resonance with me. We hear a fair bit of classical music and I am always conscious of how inadequate both our systems are after attending a concert. Home audio is a different experience and often just as enjoyable as a concert but it is different - a "window on the event"

Kevin

Hey Kevin, I know what you mean about "a window on the event". I will never forget the first time I heard Quads - the 57s. The guy doing the demo was playing some open-reel tapes that he recorded off the BBC. I could have sworn that there was a quartet playing in front of me; the imaging was superb. I bought the speakers, but unfortunately could not get them to image as well in my listening room. I get the feeling that Quads require a lot more room than MLs.

 

[Joey_V]

Hey Kevin, I know what you mean about "a window on the event". I will never forget the first time I heard Quads - the 57s. The guy doing the demo was playing some open-reel tapes that he recorded off the BBC. I could have sworn that there was a quartet playing in front of me; the imaging was superb. I bought the speakers, but unfortunately could not get them to image as well in my listening room. I get the feeling that Quads require a lot more room than MLs.

I agree, I think Quads need room to really breathe.

Even at the dealer, I felt the room was a bit smallish for the Quads to really let loose.

In other news, I have been playing with my Summits and they sound real good still. Awesome imaging, clean and clear.... perhaps without that last ounce of naturalness and perhaps a different timbre with regards to instruments but I'm lucky to have these playing for my ears. Maybe I'll hold off the Quads for a little bit...

And I haven't even gotten my new rectifier tube in yet...

 

[Satch]

Hey Joey,

What are your thoughts on acoustic treatments... Real Traps, Tube Traps, etc. with your Summits? Did you try this and post?

Satch

 

[Joey_V]

Hey Joey,

What are your thoughts on acoustic treatments... Real Traps, Tube Traps, etc. with your Summits? Did you try this and post?

Satch

I have some homebuilt absorbers/diffusors made, but I did not install them. I will do so when I move to the new cave.

 

[amey01]

I could pull the trigger on the 2905, but several things concern me...

1. I really enjoy ENJOY my Summits. The presentation I feel is "cleaner" than the Quads at the expense of perhaps being too lean. The Quads presented less hifi and more natural.
2. I know my Summits inside and out, I've played with them endlessly and I've tried so many amps, preamps, and sources on them. I know what they like to my ears... going with something new like the 2905 would bring me back to noobie level - which isn't a bad thing, but I'm comfortable with my Summits as they are.
3. Reliability of my Summits have been proven, whereas I've read several failures on the Quads. Even though my potential 2905 is brand new from an authorized dealer, 2 years is the extent of the warranty. And after this recent debacle with my rectifier tube, I sure as heck don't want to deal with system downtime.
4. If I get the 2905, I can't get the 805C.. nor do I think it would be smart to get such an amp on a speaker that is relatively inefficient at 87db. AND - with all the hoopla regarding the 805C, if they can take my Summits to another level, that would be AWESOME.

I'm mulling it over.... do I get the 2905? Do I stick with the Summits and see how it does with the 805C?

Too many questions this week... life was simpler last week.

So you enjoy the Summits, but you just want to go out and spend money - not on something that is better, just something that is different.

Wow - I wish I had your problem........

 

[risabet]

I agree, I think Quads need room to really breathe.

Even at the dealer, I felt the room was a bit smallish for the Quads to really let loose.

In other news, I have been playing with my Summits and they sound real good still. Awesome imaging, clean and clear.... perhaps without that last ounce of naturalness and perhaps a different timbre with regards to instruments but I'm lucky to have these playing for my ears. Maybe I'll hold off the Quads for a little bit...

And I haven't even gotten my new rectifier tube in yet...

Another thing about the Quads is that they are very sensitive to the amp you drive them with. The best amp I heard with the older ESL 63 was a PS Audio IIC+ 70wpc and not what one would have expected to be such a stunning match with the 63. This was compared to amps from CJ, ARC, bigger PS Audio's, Perreaux's and a few others. The PS trounced, and I exaggerate not, trounced all of the big boys.

 

[Joey_V]

So you enjoy the Summits, but you just want to go out and spend money - not on something that is better, just something that is different.

Wow - I wish I had your problem........

From my audition - as preliminary as it may have been - I feel that the Quad 2805 have more of the sound that I was looking for, the sound that I've been trying to get my Summits to sound like with all the preamps and amp combination that I've tried.

When you stop and think about what you think a stereo should sound like, you have a mental picture in your mind, you hear it in a system and you're like, "voila, that's the one."

Sorta like that. It's not that I want to spend the money (if you think about it, it's a very lateral move financially), but I just want to get to move towards the ideal, the goal, the music maker that really makes me move.

The Summits are still great though, and the question I have for myself is will this be worth all the effort? Getting the Quads - dealing with shipping it here in 1 piece, dealing with the uncertainty of its future reliability, having to put up the Summits on 'gon and having to ship it out in 1 piece, dealing with the electronics issues of the Quads, dealing with changes in the upstream due to the Quads not having synergy with the rest of my equipment....

It's not an easy choice. If I could have it, I'd have 2 systems right here right now... build the Quad system from the ground up. But alas, I'm strapped.

 

[jtwrace]

Too many questions this week... life was simpler last week.

You should be VERY thankful that this is your biggest problem. There are many that would trade...just be thankful.

 

[Joey_V]

You should be VERY thankful that this is your biggest problem. There are many that would trade...just be thankful.

I'm not complaining.... all of us here on this site should be thankful we can partake in such a diversion.

 

[kwr]

Had a listen to the 2905 today. Pretty convincing speaker driven with integrated Boulder and Metronome cdp. It has the strengths of the 63 (I have never heard a 57) with real bass, a much bigger sweet spot, good dynamic contrast, much better build quality, the effortless coherence of a "single driver" and the happy ability to sound like music. Piano (Debussy Etudes) in particular was stunning. The dealer we were at (Hifi Junction in Sydney for the Australians) is happy to home demo and seemed to think we should be able to change over with minimal penalty.

The Monolith/Quad showdown should happen in the next few weeks.

Kevin

 

[tonepub]

The Quad is a fun speaker and definitely produces it's own kind of magic.
Used do have 57's and 63's and they were great.

What drew me to the Summit and still keeps me very interested is their ability to do dynamics better than any panel I've ever heard. I would guess the ultimate choice would be what your music collection is like.

Don't expect to play Audioslave or Arnold Bax on the Quads at any kind of level, they aren't up to the task. If you are listening to a lot of Patricia Barber/Diana Krall type stuff, the Quads can be pretty intoxicating.

Here's a great amp combination for you with the Quads that is both exquisite sounding and relatively inexpensive: The Sudgen A21 SE. It is 30wpc, class A solid state and is the most tube like sounding amp i've ever heard. More than enough power for the Quads and very reasonably priced at $4000.

Another nice match up with out having to deal with tubes is the Luxman 590A - II we reviewed this issue. I was over at a friends house who just bought this amp for his new quads and it's just awesome. And has a nice phono stage built in so you can really simplify your setup.

Add the matching Luxman all in one disc player at 4K, throw it on a nice rack with your VPI table and you have a very high performance system with minimal footprint.

Big change though.

 

[Joey_V]

Had a listen to the 2905 today. Pretty convincing speaker driven with integrated Boulder and Metronome cdp. It has the strengths of the 63 (I have never heard a 57) with real bass, a much bigger sweet spot, good dynamic contrast, much better build quality, the effortless coherence of a "single driver" and the happy ability to sound like music. Piano (Debussy Etudes) in particular was stunning. The dealer we were at (Hifi Junction in Sydney for the Australians) is happy to home demo and seemed to think we should be able to change over with minimal penalty.

The Monolith/Quad showdown should happen in the next few weeks.

Kevin

Kevin,

Great to hear... are you thinking of switching over if the Quads perform equally as well at home as what you heard at the dealer? Have you been looking at the 2905 for quite some time? Interesting how the two of us have some kinda Quad fever going.

I'm more than likely going to stick with the Summits just because I'm happy with them and I don't want to have to revamp the system again.

Joey

 

[IWalker]

Kevin,

Great to hear... are you thinking of switching over if the Quads perform equally as well at home as what you heard at the dealer? Have you been looking at the 2905 for quite some time? Interesting how the two of us have some kinda Quad fever going.

I'm more than likely going to stick with the Summits just because I'm happy with them and I don't want to have to revamp the system again.

Joey

That sounds like a cop out to me, Joey Revamping is at LEAST half the fun.

Though, I'm not really one to talk, since I haven't changed much (anything) in my system in quite a while. But my feeling is...if you're thinking about changing so much...chances are it's because deep down you aren't completely happy. It's worth experimenting until you find the point at which you aren't thinking about upgrades anymore. I didn't think there was such a point until I found it. I think the only thing I'd consider upgrading to would be some of those MBL Xtreme speakers, if I won powerball or something.

 

[Joey_V]

That sounds like a cop out to me, Joey Revamping is at LEAST half the fun.

Though, I'm not really one to talk, since I haven't changed much (anything) in my system in quite a while. But my feeling is...if you're thinking about changing so much...chances are it's because deep down you aren't completely happy. It's worth experimenting until you find the point at which you aren't thinking about upgrades anymore. I didn't think there was such a point until I found it. I think the only thing I'd consider upgrading to would be some of those MBL Xtreme speakers, if I won powerball or something.

Normally, it would appear that I'm not completely happy - but in actuality, I'm actually very happy with the Summits. It's the whole the grass is greener on the other side of the fence thing... the Quads are great no doubt, but the Summits are great all on their own. I like the look of the Summits better, the sound is clean and sublime, the reliability has been topnotch, the bass is hugely satisfying, and the dynamics/headroom are better than on the Quads. That said, the Quads may have a presentation that is just a bit more musical if the right equipment is used (from what I heard) whereas the Summits actually sound a bit more hifi.

Just to show you how tough a decision like this is - IF I were starting from scratch and had to buy one pair, I'd still be in a tough pickle trying to decide between these two world class speakers. Now, take into account that I have a full system that I've built around the Summits and you'll see what I mean by the Quads may not be the most logical move at this point.

 

[David Matz]

Normally, it would appear that I'm not completely happy - but in actuality, I'm actually very happy with the Summits. It's the whole the grass is greener on the other side of the fence thing... the Quads are great no doubt, but the Summits are great all on their own. I like the look of the Summits better, the sound is clean and sublime, the reliability has been topnotch, the bass is hugely satisfying, and the dynamics/headroom are better than on the Quads. That said, the Quads may have a presentation that is just a bit more musical if the right equipment is used (from what I heard) whereas the Summits actually sound a bit more hifi.

Just to show you how tough a decision like this is - IF I were starting from scratch and had to buy one pair, I'd still be in a tough pickle trying to decide between these two world class speakers. Now, take into account that I have a full system that I've built around the Summits and you'll see what I mean by the Quads may not be the most logical move at this point.

Joey,

Maybe you need a second amp? Something like the BAT VK 55 can sound very sweet and rich when you are in the mood for that, and you got your Class A Plinius when you want to rock out.

Eventually you will need a house with 3 or 4 system rooms for all of your systems.

Another option is to see a couple of live shows every week to put the "perfect" system in perspective.

 

[risabet]

Joey,

Another option is to see a couple of live shows every week to put the "perfect" system in perspective.

In which case the perspective is not to bother! Reproduced music has never "fooled" me into believing it was live. I have found that the best systems might have the proper instrumental timbres and tonal balances, which in my experience the Quads do extremely well, but they invariably fall short in dynamic shading and ambience retrieval. I've yet to hear the imaging of an audio system replicate the imaging of an orchestra in real-life, though smaller scale groups compare quite nicely. After a recent trip to Disney Hall (An all Bach Program) my wife commented that no matter how good the system sounds, there is an ineffable quality to live sound that systems just can't match, and trust me, she's no audiowife.

 

[Joey_V]

Joey,

Maybe you need a second amp? Something like the BAT VK 55 can sound very sweet and rich when you are in the mood for that, and you got your Class A Plinius when you want to rock out.

Eventually you will need a house with 3 or 4 system rooms for all of your systems.

David,

I could see that happening now... atleast 2 systems.

 

[kwr]

Kevin,

Great to hear... are you thinking of switching over if the Quads perform equally as well at home as what you heard at the dealer? Have you been looking at the 2905 for quite some time? Interesting how the two of us have some kinda Quad fever going.

I'm more than likely going to stick with the Summits just because I'm happy with them and I don't want to have to revamp the system again.

Joey

We are certainly interested enough to home demo. We have the confluence of a number of factors that have made us think more seriously about the Quads.

In the first instance we traded our ESL63 on the Monoliths because of three things, dynamics, bass reproduction and a tiny sweet spot. The 2905 seems to have solved these problems. Our Monoliths are now 12 yrs old and will probably require a rebuild in the next few years - this is an expensive proposition in Australia. Our back room where the ML/Plinius system lives is a glass and granite acoustic nightmare where we achieve a pretty good sound which I am sure is related to the lesser interaction of a dipole cf a dynamic speaker. I have always been interested in Soundlabs but they do not seem to have a great reliability record and Sydney is an awful long way from Utah let alone the initial expense. There is no dealer in Australia. Our music habits centre on classical and jazz at moderate volumes, scarcely any rock and we value resolution tonality and soundstaging.

In short we seem to be the ideal Quad customer. The other factor driving the interest along is that after several years of quiescence regarding audio we are in a bit of an upgrade mood. If the Quads are as good as I think they will be in our big room with the Plinius setup we should be able to change over with no financial outlay selling the Monoliths and some other gear that we have loaned out and have lying around the place.

Kevin

 

[Joey_V]

We are certainly interested enough to home demo. We have the confluence of a number of factors that have made us think more seriously about the Quads.

In the first instance we traded our ESL63 on the Monoliths because of three things, dynamics, bass reproduction and a tiny sweet spot. The 2905 seems to have solved these problems. Our Monoliths are now 12 yrs old and will probably require a rebuild in the next few years - this is an expensive proposition in Australia. Our back room where the ML/Plinius system lives is a glass and granite acoustic nightmare where we achieve a pretty good sound which I am sure is related to the lesser interaction of a dipole cf a dynamic speaker. I have always been interested in Soundlabs but they do not seem to have a great reliability record and Sydney is an awful long way from Utah let alone the initial expense. There is no dealer in Australia. Our music habits centre on classical and jazz at moderate volumes, scarcely any rock and we value resolution tonality and soundstaging.

In short we seem to be the ideal Quad customer. The other factor driving the interest along is that after several years of quiescence regarding audio we are in a bit of an upgrade mood. If the Quads are as good as I think they will be in our big room with the Plinius setup we should be able to change over with no financial outlay selling the Monoliths and some other gear that we have loaned out and have lying around the place.

Kevin

Kevin,

You definitely sound a lot more of the ideal Quad customer than me. I'd be VERY interested in what you thought of the 2905 once they got into your room... please continue to update us with regards to your in-home audition. I would like to see pics too..



Joey

 

[SundayNiagara]

The Quads are fabulous speakers, IF and only IF you can live within their well-documented limitations. How many times in a speaker review have you read these words, Quadlike midrange?" Why is that? Because the Quads do the midrange better than any other speaker in existance. Are they dynamic? No! Will they play loud? No! But ooooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that midrange! Hook them up with Futterman H3AA's & get lost in the music. Folks, don't get me wrong here, I have met Gayle and have tremendous respect for his designs and could live with most ML speakers. However, the Quads are just in a world all their own. Now, before you all pile on me, please re-read my first sentence.
Mark