Summit Review

[aliveatfive]

FYI

There is an interesting and rather positive review of the Summits on the e-zine www.enjoythemusic.com. Also, next month's Absolute Sound promises a review of same.

 

[roberto]

FYI

There is an interesting and rather positive review of the Summits on the e-zine www.enjoythemusic.com. Also, next month's Absolute Sound promises a review of same.

Thanks aliveatfive...it is a good review!...and still are saying that ML does not rock!...and it is his opinion, and of course, not mine!!! Happy listening,
Pura vida,
Roberto.

 

[sleepysurf]

Actually, more of a luke-warm review. Interesting that the reviewer claims ML's have always had a definite "coloration," lacking in neutrality. I think most of us would disagree with that initial premise, thus everything else he writes should perhaps be taken with a grain of salt. I'm curious to hear what Absolute Sound says, but alas, do not subscribe to that mag.

 

[Spike]

Just a couple of items that I noticed while reading this article...

Summit, driven by Krell KAV equipments is not an optimal combination for...rock or "manufactured pop" for the Summits will ruthlessly reveal the embedded distortion through the harsh KAV electronics. Maybe this is the reason for ML speakers do not...rock!

the very distinctive metallic ringing quality and attack of the Steinway grand used in the test recording was captured beautifully

This is odd, I and lots of others have NEVER associate "metallic ringing" with Steinway grand. Steinways have always been known for their warm, organic quality.

Ok, so this is his opinions, and he did put in a disclaimer for readers to apply with...half-a-gallon of salt!

Spike

 

[Craig]

Also, you should be willing to purchase amplification that can handle their very challenging load requirements.

A Krell KAV-280p and a KAV2250 pre and power amp for this test worked well here, and for its transparency and speed, a loudspeaker cable like Nordost's Valhalla really comes into its own

This reviewer is making a claim based on an assumption rather than an actual test. The only amplification he used was the Krell as quoted above. The load requirement for the Summit is not challenging at all. Apparently the Summit is a more efficient speaker than the specs would lead you to believe. I recently drove the Summit with a Cary CAD-300-SEI (15W) and it sounded great. What other panel or electrostat speaker (besides the Vantage) can drive with just 15W of 300b tube power? Don't just take my word for it, try it for yourself.

And what's up with his claims of MLs being colored? My experience and many past reviews state just the opposite. I find MLs being the standard for neutrality and transparency. Does anyone else disagree with the "sounding colored" claim?

I agree with him saying they are an improvement over the Prodigy. They're smaller, more efficient, bass is tighter and tuneable, sound is fuller and integrates seamlessly with the panels and for all that the price actually came down from the price of the Prodigy. Now that's forward progress!

 

[Barbados]

I get the feeling that he's a diehard Wilson fan. Most people I know that really like Wilsons always have alot to fault with ML. I have also heard some of them mention MLs as colored before too. That I just don't understand...

If anything, it is likely the Summit won't have the last word in midbass slam as some higher end dynamic speakers will reveal with heavy rock/dance.

 

[aliveatfive]

What do you guys think about the statement that "Logans don't rock?" IMHO, (especially the Summits) rock like crazy. Put on some of your Stones stuff and tell me they can't do it. I also think they do great with a symphony orchestra, a chamber group or a solo acoustic guitar - a speaker for all tastes.

 

[attyonline]

Have no idea why you guys give a damn what some reviewer says. Most of these reviewers know little if anything about what they are doing. They are hired for writing proficiency, not a gifted ear. A friend of mine was lucky enough years ago to hear a system at Harry Pearson's home on Long Island where he does all the listening tests. He was appalled at how bad the system sounded, and the tech guy who set it up said it sounded great. Think of the millions of dollars of gear over the past decade sold based on a positive review by the Absolute Sound! I do not need a review to tell me how good Martin Logans are. All I have to do is listen to the competition.

 

[Trekker]

I do have to say I was quite surprise to read this too. The first review I read on the Summits was in Hi-FiNews Sept '05 by Ken Kressler. It was this review that got me interested in the Summits.

Some qoutes from the Hi-FiNews review: "What the Summits adds, in its way rewriting the rules, are unbelievable dynamics, speed, transist attack and force in measures one would sanely attribute only to speakers of the dynamic variety." , "And they still sound faster, cleaner and more precise that most cones or domes, ...", "Naturally, this speaker loved slumming it in an A/V system, coping magnificently with slams and explosions." and finally "So, if you want a gorgeous panel speaker, but refuse to forego such dynamic speaker charms as slam, slodity and real-life SPL's, this beauty could be the one."

So based on Hi-FiNews Summit review, I just couldn't figure out how the Summits couldn't 'Rock'

 

[gstring]

Have no idea why you guys give a damn what some reviewer says. Most of these reviewers know little if anything about what they are doing. They are hired for writing proficiency, not a gifted ear. A friend of mine was lucky enough years ago to hear a system at Harry Pearson's home on Long Island where he does all the listening tests. He was appalled at how bad the system sounded, and the tech guy who set it up said it sounded great. Think of the millions of dollars of gear over the past decade sold based on a positive review by the Absolute Sound! I do not need a review to tell me how good Martin Logans are. All I have to do is listen to the competition.

Werd

 

[Steve]

Sounds like this guy has a long held bias against stats and the characteristic sound they produce. For me, there was absolutely no comparison within my price range. The only box speaker that I even considered turned out to be twice the price on my ML's (and thus out of the budget).

IMHO, anyone can play loud techno pop and rock, but not many can give you the surreal experience with jazz and other more subtle music types like ML does. That's why I bought mine.

 

[Joey_V]

The guy has no idea what coloration is or what true transparency sounds like. To fully accuse the Summits of being colored is shocking since his reference speaker is probably colored in some way. To say that the Summit is colored is saying that the Summit does not sound like his reference speaker - it doesnt say whether or not the Summits are truly colored.

His conviction and belief that the Summits are colored is falsely based on inadequate experience IMO.

Believe me, the Summits are the least colored I've heard in a long while. This guy (reviewer) needs a new reference.

 

[Jeff Zaret]

Joey_V,
Do you think he really need a reference or another bottle of Jack Daniels? Obviously he is biased and has no clue but then there are people out there that like things I can not understand, i.e. Tiny Tim, Yanni (Yawni), Michael Bolton, Yugos, Pet Rocks........I guess I have said enough

Jeff

 

[jfm]

Different folks, different strokes. That's why I hang around here.

 

[garmtz]

What an irony about the neutrality bit... If he uses Wilson Audio speakers, he should read this article:

http://www.audioperfectionist.com/PDF files/APJ_WD_21.pdf

In two German magazines, they plotted the frequency response of the Summit, which (at 30 degrees off axis and > 500 Hz) was ruler flat and rivalled that of top dynamic speakers, which is an incredible accomplishment for an electrostatic speaker.

The Summit will be ruthlessly revealing to the source material. This is the reason the speaker "doesn't rock". It just shows how bad the source material is. I would say the Krell does not help in this respect, being ruthlessly revealing up to the point of being bright.

 

[garmtz]

Just read the review... It is by Alvin Gold, who I normally admire for his honesty. The review is not really negative, but it is filled with clichee.

 

[Joey_V]

In two German magazines, they plotted the frequency response of the Summit, which (at 30 degrees off axis and > 500 Hz) was ruler flat and rivalled that of top dynamic speakers, which is an incredible accomplishment for an electrostatic speaker.

DO you have links to the graphs perchance?

I'd like to see... .

JeffZ,
Yes.. the guy is drunk. LOL..

 

[tonyc]

I read the review and perceived it as positive. In comparison to dynamic speakers much of what he said is true. As a long time owner of Apogees (another speaker accused of not being able to rock) I can tell you that all the planer speakers I have ever heard suffer from a relative lack of ultimate volume compared to cones and especially horns. That said, I do think my ML Aeons will play louder than my Apogees (at least with help from the Descent) and the Summits play louder still. On the other hand I have never heard cones or horns float a soundstage like a good planar can. I can live without ultimate volume, but I need my S P A C E. I listen almost exclusively to rock and alternative rock and I reject categorically the generalization that planars do not rock! I would argue that the superior detail afforded by planar speakers lessen the need to listen at the higher volumes required by cones!

 

[twich54]

I read the review and perceived it as positive. In comparison to dynamic speakers much of what he said is true. As a long time owner of Apogees (another speaker accused of not being able to rock) I can tell you that all the planer speakers I have ever heard suffer from a relative lack of ultimate volume compared to cones and especially horns. That said, I do think my ML Aeons will play louder than my Apogees (at least with help from the Descent) and the Summits play louder still. On the other hand I have never heard cones or horns float a soundstage like a good planar can. I can live without ultimate volume, but I need my S P A C E. I listen almost exclusively to rock and alternative rock and I reject categorically the generalization that planars do not rock! I would argue that the superior detail afforded by planar speakers lessen the need to listen at the higher volumes required by cones!

Tony, I must admitt you put it Perrrrfectly ! Sometimes we all get a little too carried away with our flowery adjectives used in describing our beloved pastime, but I think you hit the nail on the head !! Besides I listen to mostly classical and various Jazz artists and I have yet to listen to a speaker that does justice to the piano like a Logan.

 

[MarkNewbie]

Joey_V,
Do you think he really need a reference or another bottle of Jack Daniels? Obviously he is biased and has no clue but then there are people out there that like things I can not understand, i.e. Tiny Tim, Yanni (Yawni), Michael Bolton, Yugos, Pet Rocks........I guess I have said enough

Jeff

Must be a lot of people out there like you Jeff. I guess that explains why I have not had any offers or calls on the Yugo I have had for sale the last six months...