STAGE Center Channel?

[68sting]

I agree the ML centers are expensive when compared to picking up used Aeruis or something similar. I considered doing some thing like this but didn't have enough room to do a perf. screen with the speaker behind it. Well I know(think) Dave and I disagree on this but I haven't heard a better speaker for a center channel then the Theater. With all the info that comes out of the center I feel it's one of the most important ML's I bought. I agree front projection is the only way to go. Luckily they are a bargain in the grad scheme of things. I recently attended a projector shoot out by a local dealer. The two low end ($2000<)projectors (Z-4/Pan. AE900) were amazingly close to the $5000 and up DLP's. You had to spend $12k-$15k on a 3 chip DLP to get a nice jump in PQ. So I say go buy used Theater and Pan. AE900 and have the best of both worlds.

 

[Peter Hogan]

I agree the ML centers are expensive when compared to picking up used Aeruis or something similar. I considered doing some thing like this but didn't have enough room to do a perf. screen with the speaker behind it. Well I know(think) Dave and I disagree on this but I haven't heard a better speaker for a center channel then the Theater. With all the info that comes out of the center I feel it's one of the most important ML's I bought. I agree front projection is the only way to go. Luckily they are a bargain in the grad scheme of things. I recently attended a projector shoot out by a local dealer. The two low end ($2000<)projectors (Z-4/Pan. AE900) were amazingly close to the $5000 and up DLP's. You had to spend $12k-$15k on a 3 chip DLP to get a nice jump in PQ. So I say go buy used Theater and Pan. AE900 and have the best of both worlds.

Hi,
I have the Panasonic AE-700 (predecessor to the 900), and when I did my research prior to purchasing it, I came to the same conclusions as you...you can't beat it without spending well over 10K. There's nothing like watching sports in HD on a 120" screen, and the thin projection screen doesn't interfere with the sound from the ML's like a big box TV does.

Peter

 

[kuebler]

$3k for a center channel is a lot to ask for what it does. I have heard all the center channels by ML, and the Theater is the only one with reasonable performance. But IMHO, that performance is not worth the current asking prices of $2800 or so new.
...
One thing I considered when auditioning the ML Centers, compared to their other speakers. Does the center out perform say a Script, Aeon, Aerius, or SL3? Remember I am comparing price versus performance?

This sounds a bit like you may have compared also center speakers from other manufacturers for operating in a ML environment.

If so, I would be very interested in your opinion, which speakers would be a good match to a well done ML setup, if price is not the primary consideration.

I am not explicitly dissatisfied with my Theater i (sitting on the floor due to a large screen), but I clearly have to acknowledge its different sound signature compared to the other 6. This becomes extremely obvious when listening to pink noise circling around during a calibration, and I ask myself to what degree this might damage the homogenity of my surround sound stage.

 

[DTB300]

This sounds a bit like you may have compared also center speakers from other manufacturers for operating in a ML environment.

If so, I would be very interested in your opinion, which speakers would be a good match to a well done ML setup, if price is not the primary consideration.

I ended up with a B&W Center. While it does not match up tonally to the panels, it was close enough for me, especially for movies. The time you can hear the biggest difference is with music playing. But I also used my parametric EQ in my HT Receiver to adjust the playback of the B&W, and while it made it better, it is not what the Theater would give me. But with the $2K I saved to live with the differences, I was able to use that toward the purchase of my used Plinius SA-102 amp (it almost paid for the entire purchase price) - a very worthwhile purchase or trade-off to deal with the differences in the centers.

Each person has to determine how much of a difference there is, and can you/they live with the differences for the cost? For me, it was a no-brainer and I have been happy with my decision.

I am not explicitly dissatisfied with my Theater i (sitting on the floor due to a large screen), but I clearly have to acknowledge its different sound signature compared to the other 6. This becomes extremely obvious when listening to pink noise circling around during a calibration, and I ask myself to what degree this might damage the homogenity of my surround sound stage.

Don't get me wrong, the Theater is a great speaker, just not worth the $2800 MSRP price. If it was priced around $1500, then I would consider it and I would think that ML would have a hard time keeping them in stock. IMO, I believe the Cinema should be priced around $1000 and the Fresco around $500 when comparing price versus performance. This again is based on price versus performance when comparing center speakers to the other ML speakers.

Dan

 

[kuebler]

...
Don't get me wrong, the Theater is a great speaker, just not worth the $2800 MSRP price. If it was priced around $1500, then I would consider it and I would think that ML would have a hard time keeping them in stock. IMO, I believe the Cinema should be priced around $1000 and the Fresco around $500 when comparing price versus performance. This again is based on price versus performance when comparing center speakers to the other ML speakers.

Dan

I can very well understand the price/performance point and I have the impression you made a good decision.

However, when looking from the other end - and high end sometimes means voluntarily violating reasonable price/performance - then I am asking myself what would be the best possible center speaker for a ML set. But to make it clear: still with a reasonable price limit, say app. $4k.

 

[DTB300]

However, when looking from the other end - and high end sometimes means voluntarily violating reasonable price/performance - then I am asking myself what would be the best possible center speaker for a ML set. But to make it clear: still with a reasonable price limit, say app. $4k.

If I had a $4k budget and I was looking for the best center for the best integration especially for music for ML's, I would purchase a Theater.

On the other hand there are many choices out there for Center Channel's and if you get a chance to listen to them by all means do so. In my listening (let me see if I can remember) I listened to Magnaplaner, Aerial (I liked theirs too as Aerial for me are a very nice sounding box/driver speaker), Paradigm, JBL, ML, B&W, and others I cannot remember at this time. I made my best price versus performance decision and lived with it, never looking back or wondering "what if". And like I stated, that extra money I saved at the time, also enabled me to purchase some other great equipment down the line.

In this fine hobby of ours, everything has a plus and minus to it and we each have to decide how much or how little of an effect it will on us, then make our final choice from there. Never worry about what if, or what others think or say, it is our system and our tastes and our decisions. Be bold, be strong, just do it, and live with it knowing you made your best decision possible at the time

Dan

 

[kuebler]

If I had a $4k budget and I was looking for the best center for the best integration especially for music for ML's, I would purchase a Theater.

I have to say that I am not angry to hear that

For me making a real comparison is awfully difficult. I think it could be done only in my home, and chances are slim for getting a dealer to move various speakers to my home, just for getting the chance of a fairly mediocre $4k business. And how even should I select this variation of speakers?

But if somebody here in the forum would have undertaken this effort already, and have come to a clear solution, then I possibly would have tried as well.

If a Stage comes out and is reported to be better than the Theater, then I will try however.

 

[DTB300]

I have to say that I am not angry to hear that

But remember this would be $4k of disposable income that would not be used for anything else but a center.

Again $2800 is a lot to spend for what you are getting with a Theater, compared to the performance and price of other ML Speakers...again in my opinion.

Dan

 

[twich54]

But remember this would be $4k of disposable income that would not be used for anything else but a center.

Again $2800 is a lot to spend for what you are getting with a Theater, compared to the performance and price of other ML Speakers...again in my opinion.

Dan

Dan, been following this thread all along, I agree totally with you (must be a W. NY thing !! ) I personally think the Fresco is over priced but my dealer took care of me. I am by no means trying to compare it to the theatre but I feel the tonal match to my Vantage's is A Ok for know.

 

[kuebler]

But remember this would be $4k of disposable income that would not be used for anything else but a center.

Don't forget that I have spent the money already, so nothing brings it back to me

Thus your statement that given a $4k budget you would still purchase a Theater and nothing else was good news from my viewpoint

 

[Robin]

The Stage will have woofer drivers...

During a routine perusal of ML site looking for information regarding the coming Stage. I found this:

http://www.martinlogan.com/itscoming/Stage.asp

I was pleasantly surprised to see that the Stage apparently will have cone woofer drivers interaged with the Xstat panel, which is good news.

 

[Joey_V]

I'll do it!

Your mission if you should choose to except it.

You must call Martin Logan, infiltrate their security and get to the bottom of this center channel business. As always if you should be captured we will deny your existence and Carrey on with our daily speculation.

This message will self destruct in 5 seconds.

Done and done... mission accomplished.. see new thread!

Signing off,
Joey - the guy who the ML reps know by name.