ML New Prez
- Thread starter Keith
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Finally!
A realist!!I have a full five channel system of ML products and love them, but I am also somewhat pessimistic by nature. High end audio is not a growth area in terms of profits, so it seems it is not likely ML will turn into a huge seller w/o selling cheap speakers at low prices. I cannot think of a great high end company that was bought out by a big corporation or buying group that ever reached its high end achievments again. Maybe someone can and that will give me some hope.The pessimistic view is that cheaper and cheaper models come out with all production eventually shifted to Asia and the end of the glory days of the marque. I hope I am wrong.
attyonline
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A good point, but we rarely see that in speaker companies. The competition in that area is fierce and almost always heads down in price to maximize volume sales. I hope I am wrong, but the odds appear that ML is heading toward low price area where so many great companies have either went out of business or out of relevance.
DrJRapp
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Klipsch has proven that a speaker line can be expanded into more profitable areas without loosing it's "heritage", good name, or performance. In fact the profits being generated in their consumer product line have allowed Klipsch to make investments in R&D for their Heritage line, which isn't really large or profitable enough to justify those investments.
Pcar928fan
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I have always had a soft spot for Klipsch speakers. Never actually owned any, but someday I probably will. Probably something from the high end of the HT line up (which means not really Hi-Fi like the ML gear or the MBL gear I have).
Yes they do, but although they are owned by Tokyo-based D&M Holdings the products are still made and designed in the USA @ Mc's Binghamton, NY plant
attyonline
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I think Klipsch is still run by family members of Paul Klipsch which of course can make a big difference.
DrJRapp
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Actually, distant family members with MBAs, not engineering degrees bought the company from PWK in the 90s, moved it from Hope, Arkansas to a corporate headquarters in Indianapolis, IN. It is no longer strictly a "family business", but a technology powerhouse. Since then Klipsch has made a lot of $$ in the computer speaker and home theater speaker business. Klipsch's commercial products division continues to bloom as more and more theaters and outdoor venues opt for their products. Their Reference Series are top notch HT speakers, their more cost effective line, the Synergy sells exclusively through Best Buy. The BB thing was a move that the hard line Klipsch purists thought would water down the company but instead has made the Klipsch name more recognizable since Klipsch products appear in BBs weekly sale flier seen by millions daily. (wouldn't you like it if your non-audiophile friends could recognize Martin Logan as a high end HiFi speaker name?) The Klipsch success story has not been without it's mis-steps, however. Klipsch purchased financially ailing Mondale Designs a few years back but were unable to successfully revive it after infusing literally millions in cash and technology. Then again on the success side of the coin they then purchased Jamo, Energy (and it's corp affiliates). All the while they have kept (and upgraded) their orginal Klipschorn, the La Scalas and even re-introduced some of the previously discontinued Heritage line. They even still make the Heritage line in Hope, Arkansas...USA
Whoever says you can't have your cake and eat it too in the audio biz, (and perhaps MLs new Prez) needs to look at that success story.
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DrJRapp
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James
You would be surprised how good the Reference series is. While the RF83 will get blown away by a Summit or Vantage or perhaps even a Vista, I think it will hold it's own very well with the rest of the ML line. OBTW, I use Klipsch Reference surrounds with my ML Mosaics and Theater i in my HT. They mix extremely well.
Yes, and ML's are made in Lawerence, KS. My point was that buy out's don't always equal death to hi fi.
David Matz
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Will go low end dilute the brand?
There's nothing wrong for corporate ML to want to make more $ and improve their cash flow as mentioned above. However, the critical question is will they dilute their brand?
How many high end brands successfully release a lower- level product under the same brand name?
Off the top of my head I can think only of Mercedes releasing the cheaper C class (still $30K car) when they were primarily known for the cars in the $50K+ market.
What ML needs to do is to release these products under a different name to avoid hurting their brand. Now, when we think of ML, we think of "High End Electrostatic Speakers". We do not think of computer speakers, products that fit well into the interior design of the house, or anything else. If ML wants to pursue that, let them under a different name. Honda did not call their high end car Honda, but called it Acura. TEAC's high end product is not TEAC, but Esoteric.
ML should release the products, learn from them, make money from them, but call them by a different name.
There's nothing wrong for corporate ML to want to make more $ and improve their cash flow as mentioned above. However, the critical question is will they dilute their brand?
How many high end brands successfully release a lower- level product under the same brand name?
Off the top of my head I can think only of Mercedes releasing the cheaper C class (still $30K car) when they were primarily known for the cars in the $50K+ market.
What ML needs to do is to release these products under a different name to avoid hurting their brand. Now, when we think of ML, we think of "High End Electrostatic Speakers". We do not think of computer speakers, products that fit well into the interior design of the house, or anything else. If ML wants to pursue that, let them under a different name. Honda did not call their high end car Honda, but called it Acura. TEAC's high end product is not TEAC, but Esoteric.
ML should release the products, learn from them, make money from them, but call them by a different name.
eknuds01
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That sounds like a good idea right there. ML has spent the better part of 2-3 decades building up their brand with a ton of great speakers. It sounds like having another lower end line is OK as long as it doesn't water down their best products-their ESL series.
Erik
sleepysurf
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I think that was their intent with the "ESL" and "Designer" series, but apparently, even astute users here on MLOC aren't aware of that line differentiation!
Exactly.
Has the Abyss, Grotto, Clarity, Fresco, Vignette, Montage, Script, Scenario, Ticket hurt the image and prestige of the Martin Logan name? They are all 'mid end' (compared to ML's high end, the average person would still consider them ludicrously high end).
So now this guy appears to be talking about going one more segment down below the 'designer' line. Yes dilution is the danger but I think the designer line showed that no one thinks less of the Summit and Vantage because of the Fresco and Montage.
-Allen
DrJRapp
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That was a marketing necessity because those companys had established themselves as low end companys from the get go. They needed the high end differentiation.
ML is already established as a high end marque. producing lower end speakers with the ML moniker will not delute the brand, but it will sell more of the lower end speakers because of the established name. Actually, that may be a good thing because it will introduce some people to ML on the entry level, and when they are ready to upgrade...as many do, they are more likely to stick with ML because of positive experience on the low end. Every company needs an affordable entry level line.
I detect a level of fear here. Not that the ML line may diminish in quality, but loose it's exclusivity.
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I don't get that at all. Reading the posts in this thread, I detect a strong sense of fear that the company will lose its focus on the high end in an effort to chase more dollars at the low end, as many companies have done.
theWB
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Couldn't have said it better myself Rich. That's exactly how I feel.
A company could make a ton more profit going after the mid-fi market because it's customer base would be much much larger than the Hi-end market. From the company or an investors perspective it would be a smart move.
lugano
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That's a great read! Let's hope ML isn't thinking of manufacturing everything but the ESL line in China!
