Martin Logan CLS IIz questions

[Jimna]

im very seriously considering the set for sale in the classified section and am finding questions. hopefully the experienced knowledge base here will stear me in the right direction.

in the ad he mentions that they are the original panels and considered repaneling them. whats the death date for a panel? how often would an owner need to do this, and whats that cost? will i be happy with these as is for sometime given this is a huge purchase for me and new panels wont happen any time soon.

also im wondering the main differences in the 3 types of CLS's. is this the best model? any advantage or disadvantage of this model over the others?

will my lowly Adcom amp work for a while pushing them? if i buy them ill be strapped for some time after, so amp upgrades will have to wait. it is rated at 150w @ 4ohm.

how is the bass with these? i have noticed folks using subs with them, is it a must?

last, and sort of silly but i havent seen the backside of one of these, whats stabilizing it? is there a leg in the back or what? may seem silly but this will matter in how i would set them up given the brand new plinths i just made....and those steal stands look like butt IMO.



and of course anything else to consider is welcomed input too. this is a very big purchase for me so i dont want to buy something i will have buyers remorse afterward. all warnings are welcomed.

 

[C.A.P]

im very seriously considering the set for sale in the classified section and am finding questions. hopefully the experienced knowledge base here will stear me in the right direction.

in the ad he mentions that they are the original panels and considered repaneling them. whats the death date for a panel? how often would an owner need to do this, and whats that cost? will i be happy with these as is for sometime given this is a huge purchase for me and new panels wont happen any time soon.

also im wondering the main differences in the 3 types of CLS's. is this the best model? any advantage or disadvantage of this model over the others?

will my lowly Adcom amp work for a while pushing them? if i buy them ill be strapped for some time after, so amp upgrades will have to wait. it is rated at 150w @ 4ohm.

how is the bass with these? i have noticed folks using subs with them, is it a must?

last, and sort of silly but i havent seen the backside of one of these, whats stabilizing it? is there a leg in the back or what? may seem silly but this will matter in how i would set them up given the brand new plinths i just made....and those steal stands look like butt IMO.



and of course anything else to consider is welcomed input too. this is a very big purchase for me so i dont want to buy something i will have buyers remorse afterward. all warnings are welcomed.

The soft truth or the hard truth??????

The soft truth is you will need new panels. And you can use the Adcom.

The Hard truth is the Panels will cost $1500 and the ADCOM will sound like Shat!

These are current hungry speakers. The Adcom will melt under these like butter in Georgia heat. I head the Adcom on the Arius and several other speakers, Sorry it was harsh. The CLS are the single most revealing loudspeaker I have heard , and it reveals the weakness of its upstream components ingloriously.

As for the stands Ugly but necessary to get the most out of these speakers. ML actually recommended them at one time. I built mine. Yes they have a side rear brace , at least it came with them when new. Many never used it as you had to drill the speaker. They are a MUST too.

I would recommend a easier to drive speaker and upgrade the amp later when funds are available. CLS are not for the weak amp department.

Subs are usually needed as many dont have enough balls to drive them with unlimited current. Bass eats power fast and these can be bass shy. I use NO sub and get great bass . Set up is the key with these. If you have no room for them, (they love a large room). Small room to these is torture on the ears and you get blurred bass. I usually do not NOT recomend these as I LOVE THEM . However in your situation, I would say NO!

Just my .02 since you asked. !

 

[JonFo]

+1 on the need to upgrade the Adcom. I had a 555 pushing my Sequels when I first got them in '92, and when I replaced the Adcom with Sunfire in '93, it was night and day.

I still have that Sunfire in my rig today, it's that good.

So whichever brand of amp you get, it must be one that can deliver the current flow a CLS requires to produce its magic.

 

[raanan17]

im very seriously considering the set for sale in the classified section and am finding questions. hopefully the experienced knowledge base here will stear me in the right direction.

in the ad he mentions that they are the original panels and considered repaneling them. whats the death date for a panel? how often would an owner need to do this, and whats that cost? will i be happy with these as is for sometime given this is a huge purchase for me and new panels wont happen any time soon.

also im wondering the main differences in the 3 types of CLS's. is this the best model? any advantage or disadvantage of this model over the others?

will my lowly Adcom amp work for a while pushing them? if i buy them ill be strapped for some time after, so amp upgrades will have to wait. it is rated at 150w @ 4ohm.

how is the bass with these? i have noticed folks using subs with them, is it a must?

last, and sort of silly but i havent seen the backside of one of these, whats stabilizing it? is there a leg in the back or what? may seem silly but this will matter in how i would set them up given the brand new plinths i just made....and those steal stands look like butt IMO.



and of course anything else to consider is welcomed input too. this is a very big purchase for me so i dont want to buy something i will have buyers remorse afterward. all warnings are welcomed.

The Adcom will not blow up.For under 300 get yourself a Behringer EP-1500.

 

[Jimna]

thanks for the honesty. thats exactly what i wanted and needed. i guess ill return to my original path of better amplification being my next step.



look for a recommendation thread on amp next.



i will have a set of panels eventually, mark my words...

 

[MiTT]

I doubt that your Adcom would "melt" Jim, but I also agree that you would suddenly discover that it isn't as "musical" as you would like. The CLS's are above everything else the most revealing speaker I can think of as the others have mentioned above. I'm sure the Adcom could likely drive a pair, but I really do think you would hear first hand why they need to be paired with the best amplification (and source) you can find and afford. I've driven mine with an old Hafler DH-500, a McCormack DNA-2SE (not bad really), a 3x150 Accurus I have around as a spare and my BAT VK-6200. The BAT is very noticibly superior to all of the others; it really isn't close at all in fact.

Now regarding the room size, I know that a big room will allow the CLS to really open up, but I don't think it's as much of a limiting factor as some might think. I've heard the CLS's in smaller rooms twice, and my room is really quite small indeed (it's only 12' x 14'). I'm not saying that I don't long to build my larger dedicated room, I'm just saying that it doesn't sound like chicken feed either, mostly I believe because of careful placement and system synergy. I should think with your room being a pretty decent size, along with all of the treatments you've put in place, you would be able to make them work pretty darn well.

Jim, we're practically neighbors. If you want to find out with certainty how your Adcom might sound with the CLS's we should set up some time after the holidays and you can bring it over and hook it up to mine so you can hear with your own ears.

 

[Dan Osib]

I disagree about the bass on the CLS's. I use them in a 15ft x 15ft room and the bass is light. The panels are exactly 39" from the back wall. There is a little bit of bass however, not a lot though. I think that a subwoofer with them is essential.

 

[Jimna]

thanks tim! i would love to hear yours, and honestly im not sure i want to hear my amp with them. i know its the weakest link in my system so no point in spreading the weakness.

.

 

[wallacefl]

I disagree about the bass on the CLS's. I use them in a 15ft x 15ft room and the bass is light. The panels are exactly 39" from the back wall. There is a little bit of bass however, not a lot though. I think that a subwoofer with them is essential.

The CLS bass drops like a rock in most rooms below 50hz...IMHO a sub is essential...just cross it fast(24db) and low(40-45hz) and:music:

 

[raygunn]

Yup. The bass is "shy". However...

as far as the bass goes, floor coupling does add some heft but unfortunately at a cost of imaging and "blurring" from panel sway.

 

[ronenash]

Hi Jimna,
I had a pair of CLS IIz for awhile. Great speakers if you have the space and take great care with placement. As for amplifier choice, and assuming you do have a large room that can do justice to the CLS, the Adcom will not be able to develop any reasonable loadness levels (that is discarding the quality of sound issues). My Bel Canto Ref1000 (500w ClassD) shut down at high levels do to the extreme current demands of the CLS. What I found that works great with the CLS and produces super details and coherent presentation with the CLS with the Conrad Johnson solid state amplifiers. I have the Motif ms 2001 which is a phenominal amplifier if you can find used. Easier to find would be the MF2500 which should also be great. Just stick to the high power models and avoid the 100w models as your loadness levels will be limited.

Enjoy
Ronen

 

[Jimna]

thanks. i do in fact have ample room to accommodate them, and i consider my endless speaker positioning my aerobic listening mode. im also all about room mods to account for rear sound waves too....

...but i have decided to build the front end before i change speakers. hell until i get a real amp in front of the speakers i have now how do i even know what their really able to do. im sure im going to want to upgrade speakers sooner than later, but i think its wise to lay a solid foundation first. also ive been advised that i might want to start with a pair of spires before i move to a CLS given my music tastes...but i really lust after a full panel.

sometime i think this is an addiction. much like a food or sex addiction. i need help.:ROFL: