Danger, Danger, here comes the CLS

[rockeratheart]

Call me a stat rookie, call me a complete newbie, call me what you will. But without hearing them, or even seeing them in person, I have begun a love affair with the CLS. Yeah I've seen them lots online. But, you know what did it? I saw the black pair on the 'gon. i don't know why, but that opened my eyes, and now I have been researching CLS. I'm closer and closer to a purchase, but I'm thinking I would love my room with a pair of those babies in it. Besides a Bad-@$$ look, IMHO, what does the cls do that the hybrids don't?

ben

 

[roberto]

Call me a stat rookie, call me a complete newbie, call me what you will. But without hearing them, or even seeing them in person, I have begun a love affair with the CLS. Yeah I've seen them lots online. But, you know what did it? I saw the black pair on the 'gon. i don't know why, but that opened my eyes, and now I have been researching CLS. I'm closer and closer to a purchase, but I'm thinking I would love my room with a pair of those babies in it. Besides a Bad-@$$ look, IMHO, what does the cls do that the hybrids don't?
ben

Hola Rockeratheart..the thing is called coherence! No crossover point, and just all electrostatic sound. If you take your time with them and setting them right, you will be in love for years, as I am and many of us (martin logan lovers) are too. Also many of us love their bass, some think their are a little bass shy (I do not) but we do reconize that for some type of music (heavy bass music) a sub woofer is a must. Happy listening, trust your ears, and start to re-discover all your music.
Roberto.

 

[C.A.P]

They can do what no hybrid can dream of. There is no muddy bass and boomy midbass where the woofer and the panel meet. They are amp needy in the current DEPT. They love open spaces. I would not trade them for anything except CLX right now ! There was a few here for sale IIRC!

 

[Craig]

A pair of CLSIIz's being driven by a tubed amp, matching tube pre, a Wadia 581i, and a Squeezebox.

An SACD played through a SET tube amp and a pure electrostat panel with a touch of well blended bass from the Descent i late at night is a nice experience! But use them with caution. The real danger with CLS speakers is that they have the ability to make smoking hot sound to the point that they will suddenly burst into flames as evidenced by this photo.

I saw the black pair that you mentioned and yes, black oak trim is a very good look on CLS. I have a pair of CLSIIz in walnut and really like these speakers. And yes I still have my Summits and Aeons but the CLSs simply do what electrostats do really well and that is they have more concise imaging and the ability to sonically dissapear. When setup right the vocalist are centered and instruments seem to float in the air putting you in the front row at the concert. I have my Descent i tuned very well right now and the bass seems just right with just enough presence when called upon.

I'm currently running my CLSIIz with a 24 watt Single Ended Triode tube amp and tube preamp. It's not what I would call optimized for rock and roll as we traditionally know but rock sounds more musical. Heavy hitting rock 'n roll is not their strong point.

I've driven these 600watt mono amps or use the 24 watt tube amp. Either one works just fine but they are each a different sound. The SS amp will definitely play louder but that's rarely needed. This tube amp has plenty of torque (current). I'm no electronic engineer but I think that's what is really needed for these big electrostatic capacitors to make decent sound.

You do need to allow for some room around the CLS to bring out the best in them. I have mine 5 feet from the front wall and almost 2 feet from the one of the side walls. If I could center them in the room that would be even better.

They are not easy to find and when you do find a pair the seller often does not want to bother with shipping. However, they require some careful packing but it is certainly do-able.

Take a look at what other speaker compares in performance in that price range. I would consider them to be a classic and they're while they are making new ones they are just slightly more expensive!

 

[rockeratheart]

Looks great!

There wouldn't be quite 5 feet between the front wall and the speakers, I could get probably 4. Maybe more. The front wall is 14 feet wide. There will be a tv between them too. But farther towards the wall.

While I'm finishing my basement and seeing where my upgrade finances put me, I'm seeming to jump from model to model and i can't decide. The logans will be in a home theater set-up, but I'm really only planning on setting them up for 2 channel. My passion is for 2 channel music. So thanks so much for all of your ideas and expertise. I could see my eventual setup having a sunfire or bryston, maybe even an older Krell KAV series. I'm probably going to be limited to around 1K for used.

I am a guitar player, and i swear by low watt, class A, hand-wired tube amps. Solid state guitar amps sound like an overdriven iPod encased in water.

I bet I would like a tube amp driving stats too. Can you make any suggestions for tube amps around 1K that are reliable - new or used!?

Thanks again everyone for everything.

Ben

 

[C.A.P]

Very nice set up Craig. Time we talk ! You need stands ! I have a few new Ideas !

Rocker you would not get the full benefit using CLS for HT. Don't do injustice and buy CLS and use them for HT/2 channel dual set up as they will not bring you what you want in both departments. They are a 2 channel speaker. They are world class at what they do, and they need space as Craig said. Remember Garbage in garbage out! The CLS are very unforgiving of upstream equipment.

 

[rockeratheart]

not good for ht

I hear what you're saying CAP, but would you say that even though I'm incredulous to the HT sound? I would be buying them purely for their 2 channel abilities. Or are you saying that because of the room size, tv being between them etc.? The quality of my HT is really not what I'm upgrading. If I can't get the CLS sound from my amp examples and the placement in the room etc., then I'll have to think differently. If it's a waste of money, then i'll have to get a different plan. Thanks for any further info.

Ben

 

[roberto]

There wouldn't be quite 5 feet between the front wall and the speakers, I could get probably 4. Maybe more. The front wall is 14 feet wide. There will be a tv between them too. But farther towards the wall.

While I'm finishing my basement and seeing where my upgrade finances put me, I'm seeming to jump from model to model and i can't decide. The logans will be in a home theater set-up, but I'm really only planning on setting them up for 2 channel. My passion is for 2 channel music. So thanks so much for all of your ideas and expertise. I could see my eventual setup having a sunfire or bryston, maybe even an older Krell KAV series. I'm probably going to be limited to around 1K for used.

I am a guitar player, and i swear by low watt, class A, hand-wired tube amps. Solid state guitar amps sound like an overdriven iPod encased in water.

I bet I would like a tube amp driving stats too. Can you make any suggestions for tube amps around 1K that are reliable - new or used!?

Thanks again everyone for everything.

Ben

Hola Ben...some of us are guitar player too and we use CLSs, like Jeff Zaret and myself. What we listen through them is like being in heaven! The size of the instruments, the stage and more over, the musician(s) feeling playing for you in your own place!...and tons of air between instruments...the piano as an example, it is so easy to understand the left hand...the harmony, you do know what I mean being you a musician. The guitar is easy too to understand the fingering of the left hand. Even if you are a classical guitar player, you can tell if the guitar is using Savarez strings, La Bella or another common brand. Also you can tell the brand of the guitar (Humphrey, Carruncho, Ramirez, Gibson, Yamaha etc) also you can tell the brand of the piano, like Steiway, Grand Piano, Boserdonfer, Yamaha etc)...trust your ears and happy listening,
Roberto.

 

[Jeff Zaret]

Ben,

I would not say that using the CLS in a HT is bad. I am using for 2 CH, MCH and for HT and I have not complaints. I think the sound is open and does a fine job. I am using a Depth for the low end with movies although my preference is 2 CH and then MCH. The 5 foot rule is not a dead-set on having. Do what works for you and you will be fine.

Yes Roberto is right on all areas!

Jeff

 

[Craig]

Very nice set up Craig. Time we talk ! You need stands ! I have a few new Ideas !

Thanks and you're right, I do need stands and would like to work with you on that. I sent you a PM.

 

[Craig]

I hear what you're saying CAP, but would you say that even though I'm incredulous to the HT sound? I would be buying them purely for their 2 channel abilities. Or are you saying that because of the room size, tv being between them etc.? The quality of my HT is really not what I'm upgrading. If I can't get the CLS sound from my amp examples and the placement in the room etc., then I'll have to think differently. If it's a waste of money, then i'll have to get a different plan. Thanks for any further info.

Ben

I would keep other options in mind that might be more suited to an HT/2 channel setup and space requirements.

I don't think it's a waste of money. I think they are an excellent value and I would expect them to hold their value if you later decide to sale them. You'd just have to deal with shipping large speakers.

You may not be taking advantage of their full potential if they are crowded with a television between them. Even so you may still like them but that will be up to you.

I wouldn't rule out the later hybrid electrostats that are narrower in design and easier to place in a room. And in most cases are somewhat less demanding on amp power. There are pros and cons with either approach but either one will sound good.

 

[User211]

I'm currently running my CLSIIz with a 24 watt Single Ended Triode tube amp and tube preamp. It's not what I would call optimized for rock and roll as we traditionally know but rock sounds more musical. Heavy hitting rock 'n roll is not their strong point.

SETs + Logans = 24 Watts, though... What sort of level can you get before things start to break up?

 

[User211]

I am a guitar player, and i swear by low watt, class A, hand-wired tube amps. Solid state guitar amps sound like an overdriven iPod encased in water.

Never a truer word spoken. I use a 6 Watt Cornford Harlequin... though my SETS have a bit more punch than that:devil: Not a lot by SS standards, though.

 

[Craig]

SETs + Logans = 24 Watts, though... What sort of level can you get before things start to break up?

It's not suited for loud music but will sound excellent at normal levels. It starts to break up at levels that are just beyond the point where I care to listen anyway. If I want loud then the Electrocompaniet mono amps will do loud very well. But the SET amp is clean, airy and a little more holographic. Bass isn't an issue since the bass signal doesn't go through the amp. It comes directly from the preamp to the Descent i. If I had the right cable adapters I could play the sub direct from the CD player but I don't think it make much of an improvement.