Just speculating, supposedly ML will release the Summit X at CES. Just speculating on what it may look like. What benefit would it be if they double panned the mylar section like the bass section on the CLX. Wouldn't that lower the crossover point (which would be a good thing)? And would it not allow the X to play louder ? Jeff from Tone cannot tell us the details so what do the others think the changes will be?
Summit X
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TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
My guess is that the Summit X will have a conventional bass driver(s) and that the things they learned with the CLX as far as the crossover it employs will be used in the Summit X.
I don't think they would use the CLX type bass panel for a Summit X because it would have to be just as big as the CLX's, which then means the Summit X becomes the CLX.
I could be wrong, though, but I think you'd be hard pressed to put a smaller ESL bass panel on and get good results. I got the impression from the folks at ML that they would've liked to make the CLX bass panel even BIGGER than it currently is to get it to go lower than 56hz, but it had to also be marketable.
All of this is guess-work on my part. Time will tell.
I don't think they would use the CLX type bass panel for a Summit X because it would have to be just as big as the CLX's, which then means the Summit X becomes the CLX.
I could be wrong, though, but I think you'd be hard pressed to put a smaller ESL bass panel on and get good results. I got the impression from the folks at ML that they would've liked to make the CLX bass panel even BIGGER than it currently is to get it to go lower than 56hz, but it had to also be marketable.
All of this is guess-work on my part. Time will tell.
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SummitX due end of January
Martin Logan is taking orders for the SummitX from dealers. They are supposed to arrive by end of January. Very much like the old Summit. Exact specs not released yet. Starting price @14k.
Martin Logan is taking orders for the SummitX from dealers. They are supposed to arrive by end of January. Very much like the old Summit. Exact specs not released yet. Starting price @14k.
RichTeer
Well-known member
My guess is that the Summit X will by much the same as the Spire, but with a bigger box to accomodate two 10" woofers (and their amps) rather than one. Not exactly an earth-shattering guess, I know! 
how do they take orders for something that costs 14k if they do not even know what it is or what it is called it surely is not a summitX somebody has to know more a nice leak at this time would be fun come on tell us what you know :devil:
I wasn't suggesting a separate bass panel as the CLX instead a double panel. Imagine a Summit today with two panels,one behind the other, the frame would be a little thicker but you would be hard press to tell the difference. It would allow a lower crossover and more seamless presentation. With a twin panel one behind the other it might increase efficiency too. Again, we are guessing here, just speculating.
Bernard
Well-known member
I guess the dealers have to take it on faith from Martin-Logan - surely most unusual, ordering something you know nothing about, even if you are a dealer !
David Matz
Well-known member
My guess is that the Summit X will by much the same as the Spire, but with a bigger box to accomodate two 10" woofers (and their amps) rather than one. Not exactly an earth-shattering guess, I know!
I think that's probably true for the most part, but I think they are messing with the phases of the woofer.
RichTeer
Well-known member
Definately gonna be called "Summit X". Well, if the model list on warranty registration page is to be trusted...
amey01
Well-known member
Why Summit x and not Summit i like all the previous models?
My guess is that it won't be too radical - I'd definitely say they will be using the same panel as the old Summit and Spire to save on R&D costs. As for the bass section, who knows, but I don't think it will be ES.
My guess is that it won't be too radical - I'd definitely say they will be using the same panel as the old Summit and Spire to save on R&D costs. As for the bass section, who knows, but I don't think it will be ES.
User211
Well-known member
As I have said before, the thing for ML to do is use the dual force panel, but smaller than in the CLX. If it can get the bass down to say 150Hz or even 100Hz all ELS before the woofer kicks in, that will be an improvement. And a big one, I think.
So go for it, ML, because User211 says so. And he is right.
:rocker::devil:Will Summit X do this? I suspect not, but if it doesn't, what a missed opportunity! Don't forget most of the R&D to do this has already been done. And it is surely, without any shadow of a doubt, the best way to "trickle down" CLX technology.
Are you listening, ML?
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Bernard
Well-known member
I guess because maybe it uses CLX technology, and they have taken "X" from "CLX".
Just my opinion. Summit X will either be a home run and take 90% of the CLX business or a flop and the Spire will take 90%of its business. How do you take a speaker that was discontinued from a lower priced model sounding better and re introducing it with the same look with x-over tweaks and call it new and improved. Again this is all speculation as of right now we are assuming that it will look the same.
In todays tight economy anyone spending $15k on a speaker can cough up the extra $3 to $4k for the top line design.
Either way It seems like a risky move on ML part. If I was releasing a model I would not re release a discontinued one that your trying to make a fit in. As stated the R&D is done already so its a cheap expenditure. However it really does not as this was a speaker that was $12k at its retail and got passed by a speaker that was 1/3 less cost. If it was me and I am no Marketing person , I would look to the CLX and redesign from there. Don't you want to take advantage of all new technology and use it to its fullest.
I think some rethinking of the CLX with its look and Tri panel design should be implemented.
Just my .02 and that aint much ..........
In todays tight economy anyone spending $15k on a speaker can cough up the extra $3 to $4k for the top line design.
Either way It seems like a risky move on ML part. If I was releasing a model I would not re release a discontinued one that your trying to make a fit in. As stated the R&D is done already so its a cheap expenditure. However it really does not as this was a speaker that was $12k at its retail and got passed by a speaker that was 1/3 less cost. If it was me and I am no Marketing person , I would look to the CLX and redesign from there. Don't you want to take advantage of all new technology and use it to its fullest.
I think some rethinking of the CLX with its look and Tri panel design should be implemented.
Just my .02 and that aint much ..........
DrJRapp
Well-known member
ML could hit a home run with the Summit X if they made a CLX "type" speaker optimized for smaller rooms. It appears from Jeff's CLX thread that the CLX/ dual Descent package does it's best breathing in a room larger than most of us have , so the Summit X could be a CLX for the rest of us! If they then made it self powered with a optimized amps it could be a grand slam.
Most manufacturers don't make the bulk of their profits off their flagship model, but the flagship becomes the inspiration for the rest of the line. That inspiration drives the entire company's sales.
Most manufacturers don't make the bulk of their profits off their flagship model, but the flagship becomes the inspiration for the rest of the line. That inspiration drives the entire company's sales.
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sleepysurf
Well-known member
I hate to be a naysayer, but IMHO, ML is merely following the trend in consumer electronics to introduce "new and improved" models on an annual basis. The Spire, and all the recent new "Design Line" models are just "tweaks" of the previous models, more or less aimed at lower price points in the market, because that's where the $$ is. The CLX is a niche flagship model, but I don't think much of the CLX technology is transferable to the rest of the line. I think the Summit X will be evolutionary, not revolutionary, but I don't see a particularly large market for it (particularly with Tweeters now kaput). Witness the number of Summits still languishing on A'gon, and elsewhere. I hope I'm wrong. Time will tell!
User211
Well-known member
See my post on this thread. Why don't you think it is possible? Just curious...
As I have said before, the thing for ML to do is use the dual force panel, but smaller than in the CLX. If it can get the bass down to say 150Hz or even 100Hz all ELS before the woofer kicks in, that will be an improvement. And a big one, I think.
So go for it, ML, because User211 says so. And he is right.
Will Summit X do this? I suspect not, but if it doesn't, what a missed opportunity! Don't forget most of the R&D to do this has already been done. And it is surely, without any shadow of a doubt, the best way to "trickle down" CLX technology.
Are you listening, ML?
Or just save some R&D and make the Stat a full range dual force panel. You will have a smaller foot print and similar look to the outgoing Summit using the same tooling.
sleepysurf
Well-known member
The trend in speaker design is clearly "smaller footprint", less obtrusive models. The CLX TRIPLE bass panel handles ~56-360 Hz. A narrower version would be more limited in the lower end, and still require a standard stat panel for the mids/highs. I don't see how they could be integrated in a lower-priced and smaller footprint model. Perhaps (like Gillette razors), ML will announce their QUAD or QUINTUPLE panel design, for a smoother listening experience.
User211
Well-known member
Dual force isn't necessary, or even desirable, at high frequencies. It's just to get decent bass out of an ESL.
