Prodigy - Summit swap

[thepogue]

I have been a long time Prodigy owner and after 5 years or so came to the realization that my room is just to small for my babbies. (I've always known it but was in denial) The main issue is the bass overloads the room and I think over time my ears and my musical taste have changes so I just couldn't keep them in that set-up so I took them out of service for a bit. In the mean time I picked up some Aerial 10 T which work much better for the room...and although they can't touch the Prodigy's imaging wise I'm really enjoy them quite a bit.

I was just ready to head to Audiogone to move the Prodigy's out when I got an offer (from a friend) to swap for a set of Summits. He has a larger room and wants more impact and of course I'm thinking the powered subs will give me the control I'm looking for as to not overload the room.

I'm sure there's lots of feedback but here's the real question I'm asking from the ML experts....

Is the Prodigy - Summit a good trade??

I know they were both kinda around the same price point but I've not heard them side by side....I have heard my friends Summits in the past and they had that awesome ML sound-stage and imaged like mad....they just didn't seem to have the impact my Prodigys' did..

so again....love to hear your thoughts!

Thanks!

 

[roberto]

Hola. I have a Summit Power Point Presentation, if you PM with your email address, I can send it to you...you will see the new technology that it is behind the Summits.
R.

 

[PartTimeJedi]

Based on logic (excluding room sizes) yes the Summits will fit allot more appropriately than the Prodigy's, I have heard them (Summits) in very small spaces working brilliantly. With old skool MLs you do need room for the bass to breath.

 

[Bernard]

Have you tried room treatments and repositioning the speakers?

 

[thepogue]

Roberto - PM sent TY!

PTJedi - Yes given the situation it seems like a logical trade. I really just wanted to get a sesne if they are both in the same league so-to-speak.

Bernard - Yes I have added what treatments I could but placement is a wash. Small room big speakers = boom boom. I know the placement on the Summits will be limited but the bass control will help (I'm hoping).

At some point I will build a dedication room where room-size isn't an issue. I think the Prodigy's would do a bit better in a bigger room. I could be wrong here but my friend wanting to swap kinda confirms this as he owned both. My first game plan was to store the Prodgys but the room could be a few years and considering there is a life-cycle of sorts for the panels I was going to sell them locally (Virginia) and fund a new TT and just roll with the Aerials till the room is complete. Now this came up and me head is spinning....wish I would have known first. Anyone interested in some box speakers

 

[Rich]

What room size are you talking about? Can you put good bass traps in the corners of your room? That would help solve a lot of the "boom boom." There is a tradeoff between the two speakers. The Summits do some things well that the Prodigies don't, and the Prodigies do some things well that the Summits don't. The Summits give you better top to bottom coherence and pinpoint imaging, while the Prodigies give you better upper bass / lower midrange and a bigger soundstage. However, these characteristics are highly influenced by room acoustics. Either speaker could have issues in your smaller room. I own Summits and love them, but if I had Prodigies, I don't think I would trade them for a pair of Summits, personally. In many ways, I think the Prodigy is a better overall speaker than the Summit. My room is about 14' by 19' and every corner is fully treated with bass traps.

 

[thepogue]

My room is a 12 x 14....yes I know...wayyyy too small for either of these babies to stretch out! I'm off to hear the Summits next week.....should be fun!

 

[Rich]

Ouch! 12 by 14 is pretty small. You may be better off with the Summits in that size room, just for simple scale, not to mention the 25 hz and 50 hz controls. Any chance of moving to a larger room in the future? If not, I would seriously consider the trade. Just be sure to demo the Summits with some good deep male vocals or something with some upright bass (something that you know well how it sounds on your Prodigies) to make sure you can handle their relative thinness (compared to the Prodigies) in the lower midrange.

 

[Neil H]

I have owned both Prodigys and Summits and for some of that time had both speakers at the same time. I found the Prodigy had more impact than the Summit and had a bigger image size. The image was also placed higher in my room ie. above chair height whereas the Summit was approximately at chair height. It may be different in other rooms but that is how it worked in mine. I have since replaced both with Magnaplanar 20.1s. The Summit is a great speaker but over time I couldn't get entirely use to the lower image size and height and was looking for something that produced a bigger sound. The Prodigy certainly produced that but in comparison the Summit seemed to have more refinement and precision of image. It is all a matter of taste but if you are looking for a realistic presentation in terms of scale and impact them I stick with the Prodigy. Of course you do say that your room is too small for the Prodigy so you may have little choice in what you do. The Summit would work better in a smaller room and there is nothing worse than a speaker which overloads the room with bass.

 

[roberto]

Right with the bass observation, a reason why the Summit comes with two woofers, driven by two power amplfiers on each speaker and a contour of two adjustment areas, one at 25Hz +-10dB and another at 50Hz +-10dB. Taking off both controls at minimum, there is no bass at all...and this is true for any room size. You are allow to adjust these bass zones with an outstanding results!... The curve is not 50Hz and only 50Hz...touches 65Hz and 35Hz... it is not parametric. As you are sayiing, everything is a matter of liking. With the Summits you are allow to adjust easier more room resonances than the old style of ML. Also, I like micro-perf, vacuum bonding stat panel with Xtat technology. I find these guys more precise with dynamics at high frequencies, with better panel resolution, with coherence bewteen the midrange and high frequency and great the blend bewteen the woofers and the electrostatic panel. Happy listening,
R.

 

[thepogue]

wow some great stuff here....Neil hit it on the head for me as far as bass overloading it gets in the wya of the music. I wrote ML to see what effect disconnecting one of the bass drivers would have.....I'm sure its not optimal...but I'm working hard to make it work...

roberto....sound like they really got loads of bass control...again maybe for me just what the Dr's ordered!

 

[Rich]

You never answered my question about Bass traps. If you are able to place some decent bass traps in your room corners, your prodigies aren't likely to overload the room with bass. That would certainly be better than disconnecting one of the bass drivers.

 

[thepogue]

simple stated no I cannot employ bass traps in the room due to size and configuration.

 

[robertawillisjr]

I would sell the Prodigy's (this should not be a problem) and use the money to buy one of the smaller/newer ML's or some other brand. If you can't treat the room properly for the Prodigy or Summit then you will probably still have probelems with the low end. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Gordon Gray]

Robert,

My sense is that the Summit is pretty user friendly if you have room bass issues and want response down in the upper 20's.

I didn't need any bass traps when I owned the Summits. When I switched to the MBL's, I definitely required some bass treatment because of the way the drivers loaded the room.

GG

 

[PartTimeJedi]

Touching on what Neil and Gordon have said. I would given your room go with Summit without a doubt if you have to choose, but for me the Prodigy type Logan (bigger/wider/taller panel) would be more ideal from my personal viewpoint for absolute enjoyment.

 

[Rich]

Honestly, in a 12' by 14' room with no bass trapping, I don't think the Summits are going to give any more flexible bass response than the Prodigies. You are still going to have some awful room modes and overloading and no real way to compensate for them except to keep the volume down low. I think I might have to agree with robertawillis' suggestion: Go with a Source or Electromotion in that size room.