Martin Logan At Silverstone 2010

[User211]

Great photos Justin, you have me all randy now. RMAF cant get here soon enough.

We were looking at Denver on YouTube. It looks great - I nearly made RMAF this year. But eventually we decided to go to Dubai... after chucking out San Fran/Hawaii as an option too.

 

[Peter Soderberg]

Hello User211, this is Pete Soderberg and yes, I am not dead. Justin asked me to occasionally jump in to keep certain facts straight. I have just taken on more west coast activities so could not do international anymore. I will miss it all, but Bob and John, my raplacements may get me back over there once in a while. Silverstone was very nice last year and I always like to press the flesh.
Yes, break in definitely sounds like more was needed. I have done shows with Ethos so know that time will take care of that. Obviously, I wasn't there so can't comment on the sound as a whole. As to 1.7's, they are a great deal and we welcome them. MLs position is it is great to have another because no matter who you buy, we win since you are now out of the box.

 

[User211]

Hi Peter - glad you're alive and well. In case you are wondering, I am the chap who shot the CLX / MBL video at Silverstone 2008: link. I think we exchanged a sentence or two at 2009 too.

Checking the show guide, which usually contains valuable information about the exhibitors and what they have on display, I was surprised to find virtually no information this year. So the exact Transrotor configuration remains unknown.

Anyway, time for some Burmester beaters. Well, actually not, but a little light hearted fun every now and then never hurts

 

[User211]

Devoid of show guide info, I can't say too much about exact equipment designation in general (who cares anyway - it's all good porn), but this small room sounded great with the Systemdek 3D TT and Mastersound 845s pushing the Art Deco speakers.

The Mastersound 845s look fantastic in the flesh, and judging by the sonics in here, they are good amps. The TT and Deco 20 speakers appear to be good too. Google is your friend if you want to know more.

 

[tonepub]

I concur with your analysis. A year or so ago I auditioned Burmester's top of the line system at a dealer in Atlanta. Nice, big, acoustically-treated room and a system that cost well over a hundred grand. Dull, lifeless, un-involving sound. No big surprise Jeff likes them. They are expensive and they have a huge advertising budget. :ROFL:

You really are an idiot. I'm tired of you always taking a shot at us. I've had plenty of people listen to my system and tell me it's one of the best they've heard anywhere. But you love to take the shot every chance you get. If that makes you feel better about yourself, carry on.

I suspect you are terribly insecure, terribly jealous or just don't have any manners. Burmester doesn't pay any more for an ad than anyone else does in the magazine. And they don't spend a lot on advertising.

But if you actually knew anything about the high end audio industry that you always feel so compelled to make snide comments about, you'd know that.

For what it's worth, a few of my friends that attended this show told me Burmester had terrible sound as well. Again, if you went to a lot of shows and actually heard anything, you'd know this.

I've heard every major brand there is sound great and sound terrible at various shows. A show is usually the worst place to evaluate sound. And if you heard Burmester at the same dealer in Atlanta I did, I would agree with your analysis, but that was far from Burmester's top gear. I would place most of the blame on the Transparent cable, if it's the system I'm thinking of.

It's really no skin off my back, I like the Burmester electronics. But in the end you know nothing about me, my business or my system. I suppose I could make the same types of comments about you, etc etc. but you don't even list what's in your system here. We know you have a pair of Summits and a tube CJ power amp.

Far as I'm concerned you're just another troll on a forum who would never have the nerve to be this rude in person, but because you sit behind a computer you feel like a big man.

Pretty pathetic if you ask me.

 

[Rich]

You really are an idiot. I'm tired of you always taking a shot at us.

Then perhaps you need to learn to treat others on this forum with a little more respect. I rarely take a shot at anyone who doesn't take one at me first. So when you type stuff like:

Here we go again.... ML has a new model, Rich hasn't heard it and he's grumpy about it. Want to talk about a yawn.

without even addressing the substance of my post, I consider that a personal attack and I tend to respond in kind. You have a long history of attacking and bullying others on this forum and I am not the type to sit back and take it. Seems you are a little more sensitive when you are on the other end of the rude comments.

I suspect you are terribly insecure, terribly jealous or just don't have any manners.

Or, it could just be that I have strong opinions and am willing to stand up for myself. I know . . . bullies hate it when people stand up for themselves. And they have no sense of humor when they're the butt of the joke.

Far as I'm concerned you're just another troll on a forum who would never have the nerve to be this rude in person, but because you sit behind a computer you feel like a big man.

Troll? Hardly. I have been on the forum longer than you have. I have had some very pleasant visits with several members of the forum at their homes. I have been to the National get-together that we had in Lawrence a few years back. And I actually hung out with the guys from the forum at RMAF last year. Unlike some who were too busy with their professional duties to mingle with the riff-raff.

Bottom line is: you treat me with respect, and I will treat you the same. Discuss the substance of my posts without taking personal shots at me, and I will do the same. That really isn't so hard for an adult to understand, is it?

 

[User211]

You really are an idiot. I'm tired of you always taking a shot at us. I've had plenty of people listen to my system and tell me it's one of the best they've heard anywhere. But you love to take the shot every chance you get. If that makes you feel better about yourself, carry on.

The fact is, Jeff, Rich really isn’t an idiot. He’s made some truly excellent posts on this forum, some of which have been very perceptive and insightful.

If you feel he is taking shots at you, perhaps you need to ask yourself why? I really don’t think it’s because he’s jealous that your system is better than his.

For what it's worth, a few of my friends that attended this show told me Burmester had terrible sound as well. Again, if you went to a lot of shows and actually heard anything, you'd know this.

Reads pretty poorly – you mean Burmester not only sounded poor here – but poor at a lot of shows? No the best endorsement.

It's really no skin off my back, I like the Burmester electronics. But in the end you know nothing about me, my business or my system. I suppose I could make the same types of comments about you, etc etc. but you don't even list what's in your system here. We know you have a pair of Summits and a tube CJ power amp.

But he does know quite a bit about your system and your business, as many of us do. You’ve posted your system here, you regularly tell us about the latest kit you have acquired and the output of your business is for all to see. Rich has also stated other components he owns, like Ascents and Sanders power amps which he has endorsed very positively.

Far as I'm concerned you're just another troll on a forum who would never have the nerve to be this rude in person, but because you sit behind a computer you feel like a big man.
Pretty pathetic if you ask me.

If you knew the amount of PM’s I have received from various members and ex-members of this forum, let alone the content of those PM’s and e-mails, then you’d realise just how hypocritical that is.

A lot of people have been seriously, and I mean really, really seriously upset by your posts, Jeff. I feel it is my responsibility to let you know about it, for your own benefit.

The above paragraph is not an exaggeration. It is plain fact.

Enough said.

 

[Bernard]

I must admit I was a bit surprised to see two pairs of CLX Anniversary's at the show. I would have thought they would have all gone by now - didn't they only make 100 pairs? In which case, sales must surely have been low...?

Justin, these must be their show models as you can no longer buy them on their website.

 

[David Matz]

The Burmester racks look very "industrial", but I have always found them very attractive. If I had the spare cash, though, I would buy a RixRax before anything else. I'm getting a bit disillusioned with my Salamander.

Bernard, I love that rack also. I would not call it "industrial". That style implies clunky, cold, and impersonal. I would call these racks modern and elegant.

Does anyone know if they are made by Burmester and what the price points are?

 

[User211]

I was thinking they may have been Absolute Sounds's (the UK Distributors) "demoers" since their introduction, Bernard. A silver and black pair seemed to have turned up a few times now.

 

[Bernard]

Bernard, I love that rack also. I would not call it "industrial". That style implies clunky, cold, and impersonal. I would call these racks modern and elegant.

I think of them as industrial in the sense that they are really just metal brackets with wood shelves and very visible fasteners, albeit put together very attractively.

It would be interesting to find out the price.

 

[User211]

Anyway, here's some Pure Sound pics. I'm not sure if this stuff is available Stateside - but if it isn't, well, erm, enjoy the pics?

The newbies are the 845 monoblocks. These are the amps I was comparing with the NAT 211s earlier in the report. All black and gloss black kit never seems to photo well - at least with a cheap camera. More information about this and the other Pure Sound kit can be found here.

I haven't heard much Pure Sound kit so I can't really comment on the sonics. It mainly seems to feature on display rather than in a system.

 

[David Matz]

I think of them as industrial in the sense that they are really just metal brackets with wood shelves and very visible fasteners, albeit put together very attractively.

It would be interesting to find out the price.

Now here is an industrial style rack - it has no elegance. The purpose of the design is to showcase the material:

http://www.livingetc.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=5146




As for price, I am sure it costs more than most members' speakers.

 

[User211]

The Pure Sound kit was in the Coherent System's room, as was the Oracle CD player which we've probably all seen before, and the latest Oracle Delphi 6, which got some good press here.

Cabasse speakers always seem to hit the spot with me. These are the new Pacific 3 SAs driven by Bel Canto CD and Belles amps. Just good, clean sonics from these. Hard to pic obvious holes in. 450 Watts of active bass per channel.

 

[Bernard]

Now here is an industrial style rack - it has no elegance. The purpose of the design is to showcase the material:

True, they are at opposite ends of the spectrum. This is the one I'd like to get; it's customized, so is more than the basic $4,000 price. No screws; it is welded.
http://www.rixrax.com/images/BabyGrandCut.gif

 

[User211]

Bernard, I love that rack also. I would not call it "industrial". That style implies clunky, cold, and impersonal. I would call these racks modern and elegant.

Does anyone know if they are made by Burmester and what the price points are?

Burmester racks prices in Euros

 

[Bernard]

Burmester racks prices in Euros

About the same price as Rix Rax, which I prefer.

 

[David Matz]

Burmester racks prices in Euros

Thanks, Justin. That's kind of a lot of money. But it is VERY nice looking furniture.

But I would bet some Stillpoints under the gear would make a much bigger sonic difference at a fraction of the cost if sonic improvements is what one is after.

 

[User211]

From the Right Note, Bath, near me – Jeremy’s DCS/VTL/Focal set up. This system seemed to polarise opinion quite a bit – some liked it, and some really didn’t.

However, when I was in there, with what was being played, I can only say this is the best I have ever heard a pair of Focals sound. Then again, the front end is pretty impressive.

The DCS kit seemed livelier than I have ever heard it sound too. Note I was completely underwhelmed by a DCS/Focal demo using Spectral amps a while back. So maybe a lot of what I enjoyed here was a result of the VTL amps. I’m in agreement with David Matz – I think these are pretty special amps indeed. Not cheap, though.

The trouble with shows a lot of the time is the material being played. You can only form a brief opinion based on what you heard with the material being played for the brief time you are in a room. Often, you can return to a room to have your opinion revised because of this.

Jeremy lent me some gear some years back for quite some time to evaluate. I believe you’ll get very good service from him if you are in the region and looking for a top notch system, unlikely though it is many UK buyers will see this post.

So here we have the DCS Paganini USB DAC fed by a laptop and MB 450 monoblocks (in use). There’s also a silver S-400 Siegfried stereo amp in the main system pic. The room was huge – too big for the Focals, really, but was strikingly clear and detailed with great rendition of spatial cues.

The MB 450 Mk III retails here at £17.5K. I’d love to try them with my Duetta Sigs, but I’m not spending that much on amplifiers. Period.

 

[User211]

Whilst we're on the subject, more VTL pics...

Listed in order of appearance: inside a VTL TL5.5 pre. VTL preamps are not simple affairs, it would seem. £5,950. £7,900 with phono stage.

TL 7.5 MK II two-box pre. £18,250.

ST150 stereo power amp. £5,700.