Lampizated DAC Kit

[Bernard]

I've been antsy to get back to working with hardware and tweaking electronics. Since I got rid of my MDAC I was thinking that I should look at a DAC in kit form, preferably low-cost, so that if I don't like it there's no great monetary loss. Browsing ebay I came across a "Lampucera1.0 + Lampizator", which caught my eye with the Lampizator name, and it sells for US$140!

It is out of China. My understanding is that Fikus recommended some component changes in the digital part, and designed the tube buffer part.

I was wondering if Kedar or Justin, our resident Lampizator experts, are familiar with this product.

I would not expect Golden Gate (or even Amber) performance at this price level, but think it would be interesting to try.

As we are not allowed to post links to ebay listings, I'm just posting the title and picture.

24bit/192KHz TUBE DAC DIY KIT - Lampucera1.0 + Lampizator CS8416 + CS4397

 

[bonzo]

Hi sorry mate, no idea. All his ideas from before high VFM and his DIY blog was followed by many DIY people before he went commercial at Level 3 dac. So whatever kit you would have got will give you sufficient value but below level 3, will be my guess

 

[User211]

I had a level 3 for a bit. Had a lot of character with immense bass. But it was a very enjoyable listen despite obvious colouration.

I think it will be enjoyable if not exactly accurate sounding, Bernard, at a guess. We await your verdict!

 

[amey01]

Buy it, build it, and tell us your verdict Bernard.

 

[Bernard]

I think I'm going to do more reading on computeraudiophile before proceeding. I also want to read more on the differences between R-2R and Delta-Sigma. I'm surprised that my cheap old Marantz DAC (chip number scratched out, but probably R-2R) sounds much better than the MDAC did. It's too bad I could not try the MDAC using the SPDIF input - I was scared of breaking another one of the crappy RCAs.

 

[amey01]

I think I'm going to do more reading on computeraudiophile before proceeding. I also want to read more on the differences between R-2R and Delta-Sigma. I'm surprised that my cheap old Marantz DAC (chip number scratched out, but probably R-2R) sounds much better than the MDAC did. It's too bad I could not try the MDAC using the SPDIF input - I was scared of breaking another one of the crappy RCAs.

That's bizzare Bernard - that M-DAC comprehensively outperforms the Naim n-DAC which I was about to buy. Granted, it's a bit long in the tooth these days, but still.

.....and those cheap, nasty RCAs on that Lamip kit look worse than the M-DAC ones any day.........and whatever happened to "short signal paths" - they look as long as possible there.

 

[Bernard]

That's bizzare Bernard - that M-DAC comprehensively outperforms the Naim n-DAC which I was about to buy. Granted, it's a bit long in the tooth these days, but still.

.....and those cheap, nasty RCAs on that Lamip kit look worse than the M-DAC ones any day.........and whatever happened to "short signal paths" - they look as long as possible there.

Adam, that is indeed bizarre, but I hear what I hear.

I'm not too concerned about those RCAs as I already have what Fikus calls "Gucci RCAs".

The middle board is the DAC board, and the signal paths there are short from the size of the board. The tube buffer is an add-on, hence the extra board.

 

[Bernard]

That's bizzare Bernard - that M-DAC comprehensively outperforms the Naim n-DAC which I was about to buy. Granted, it's a bit long in the tooth these days, but still.

.....and those cheap, nasty RCAs on that Lamip kit look worse than the M-DAC ones any day.........and whatever happened to "short signal paths" - they look as long as possible there.

Adam, there is another factor to the "bizarreness", and Roberto has made this point often: we may not like the same things, so you could well prefer the MDAC to what I'm using now.

I've been looking at a few diy forums, and in one post the guy says he has listened to a bunch of DACs, and keeps preferring ladder network-type DACs; the Delta-Sigma ones just don't do it for him. Maybe there's something like that at play here?

 

[amey01]

Adam, there is another factor to the "bizarreness", and Roberto has made this point often: we may not like the same things,

Yes, absolutely. If we all preferred the same thing, there would be only one brand of kit available! Nobody would buy anything else

 

[roberto]

Yup, right on! And also time to say that my ears are not believing what they do hear with my new Exasound DSD Dac... a truly jewel to use with any system too, and a big challenger for those mega bucks DACs in the market place.

By the way, I just gave myself a birthday present: a new Silent Guitar by Yamaha modelo SLG-130NW

http://data.yamaha.jp/sdb/product/i...st/17C6FE0D5BD8464F9DA3A6445CFEE450_12073.jpg

Happy listening guys!

 

[Bernard]

I finally decided against buying the DAC in post #1 of this thread.

Instead, I went the pseudo-Audio Note route. I know that Justin, Kedar, and Adam don't like Audio Note, but Fikus does!

On eBay I bought (from China) a board that is supposedly a knock-off of an Audio Note design. Fikus bought a DAC board (a long time ago) from the same vendor and liked it, so I figured it was a reasonable gamble. It uses the same ladder DAC chip as Audio Note does (AD1865), and the same topology. The seller stated in his ad that the audio transformers were salvaged. They don't look like much, but what can you expect for US $148? It goes up to 192kHz, and, like Audio Note, is non-oversampling.

I bought a chassis on eBay as well, from China. It had all of the holes and connectors needed for a preamp; the only thing missing was a hole for a fuse holder. It was very reasonably-priced at US$66 (but a lot more after I paid shipping and brokerage fees). I'm not crazy about the RCA connectors supplied, so I'm using better connectors, which I already had.

The vendor does sell the custom transformer required, but on a diy forum a member stated that you should not buy transformers from China, as when they fail they do so in spectacular fashion. A single American-made custom transformer would have cost me well over $300, so instead I used three transformers that cost under $100 total. The ironic thing is that they were all made in China after all, but are all UL listed.

The unit has four inputs, one transformer-coupled and three capacitor-coupled; I wired up one of each, using reasonably-priced ($12/meter) Furutech digital cable. Switching between the two is electronic. After a short comparison I decided to stick with the capacitor-coupled input for a while; It seemed better, but I can't be sure. I'll go back later to the other, and listen some more.

The attached picture shows my build.

I like it....VERY MUCH! It is very much better, top to bottom, than the Audiolab MDAC I had, and the DAC section of my Marantz CD recorder. This is, of course, in combination with my Gustard U12 USB/SPDIF converter. Darn, now I'm thinking I should upgrade my digital cable from Cardas Lightning to MIT Digital Reference. I heard the difference before when I had both cables; sold them after I sold my CAL Labs DAC seven years ago.

The resolution of this DAC is amazing. Bass is deeper and more solid; there is a better bass foundation. I hear instrumental lines I never heard before. Resolution on the guitar intro to one specific song is astounding. My wife mentioned how impressed she was with the unit, that it was one of the two or three things she's heard over the years in my system that were outstanding.

I do hear a bit of harshness at the top end, but I expect that this will go away after the capacitors have burned in. At a later date I plan to upgrade the output caps and the power supply electrolytic caps.

All told, it cost me about US$500.

Note on the layout: it's not ideal as the transformers are close to the board; but I could always install a shield down the middle. I laid it out this way so the output section is far from the transformers, which take up a lot of real estate. I have not heard any hum or noise.

 

[Bernard]

Another picture...

 

[User211]

Cool stuff B. Have you got a link to the Lucasz page where he tries this out?

A link to the ebay auction?

What tubes are in it and who makes them?

Plenty of scope to play with it over time, change the caps/tubes etc etc. So much more flexible than a solid state OEM jobbie.

I actually like the Audio Note DAC 4.1 in an all AN system with AN/E speakers. In my system a 4.1 sounds very good in many ways but the thing is just too coloured to live with long term.

 

[Bernard]

Cool stuff B. Have you got a link to the Lucasz page where he tries this out?

Lucasz did not buy this board; he bought an SS board from the same vendor, Raindrop_hui. This is the link:
http://lampizator.eu/lampizator/references/NOS-DAC_AD1865/ad1865.html

A link to the ebay auction?

The eBay auction ended a few months ago, so there is no link. In any case we aren't allowed to post them here. If you search the vendor on ebay you will come up with a listing for a SS DAC.

What tubes are in it and who makes them?

The tubes are 6N1, made by a Chinese company whose logo I don't recognize (attached). There is some discussion on the net about equivalents, but nothing definite.

Plenty of scope to play with it over time, change the caps/tubes etc etc. So much more flexible than a solid state OEM jobbie.

I actually like the Audio Note DAC 4.1 in an all AN system with AN/E speakers. In my system a 4.1 sounds very good in many ways but the thing is just too coloured to live with long term.

Yup, looking forward to it.

It's interesting that you only like the AN DAC in an all-AN system - the components were "voiced" to work best together, it seems.

 

[amey01]

Congratulations Bernard. To clarify - I never said I didn't like AN - simply that I don't believe they're worth the hype/cost.

Glad you enjoy what you have - great review too

 

[User211]

I definitely prefer AN Japan. Their products somehow have much more cool appeal to me. Stupid prices, though that is part of their appeal i.e. the fact you know you will never own them.

 

[R.I.P]

Great work Bernard, congratulations!

Bernard the internals of the DAC look well laid out with neat and clean sutures.

I am glad your do it yourself job provides you with much concrete satisfaction.

You have the ability to create and perhaps would be fun for you if you try building other

electronic stuff too.

I never built anything electronic however when I was a child in the 80s enjoyed building cars

from my Lego play set. Gave me immense satisfaction to create something using my hands and

intellect.

Have fun listening to music, my friend!

 

[Bernard]

Bernard the internals of the DAC look well laid out with neat and clean sutures.

I am glad your do it yourself job provides you with much concrete satisfaction.

You have the ability to create and perhaps would be fun for you if you try building other

electronic stuff too.

I never built anything electronic however when I was a child in the 80s enjoyed building cars

from my Lego play set. Gave me immense satisfaction to create something using my hands and

intellect.

Have fun listening to music, my friend!

Thanks Rehan. I designed and built electronics for medical research from scratch for four years before I moved to telecom, so this was a relatively easy build; it did have its challenges, though. Unfortunately, many years ago I developed an allergy to solder fumes (chemical bronchitis) so I now approach such builds with a lot of caution; I choose my projects very selectively.

 

[roberto]

Hola. I do feel myself a little conspiratorial with your project Bro. I would be very proud, as you are, because the work done is clean, well designed, with space inside.

I see at the beginning, in the pics in the first page, three transformers, and at the end of the project, only one toroidal. I can imagine the bad instructions and all the thinking work done, because when there is no instructions or better say, just a few drawings that are very complicated to understand, you feel at the limbo land.

Well done, and what its best, the new improved sound in your system. Its good to know that you are that happy with your new toy. It took a little time to make it work, but the time invested is paying a lot of listening pleasure.

Very happy listening Bro!

 

[Bernard]

Roberto, yes it was a challenge to build it with no instructions at all, and schematics that were unclear, not to mention that it looked like the board markings contradicted the schematics. Your help was invaluable; thank you.

There are actually two toroidals. My selection of transformers was based purely on cost. Looking back, if I were to build it today, with the knowledge I have now, I would save about $20.

I wish you could listen to it!