Impressive Integra

[jk319]

I re-read your orig post. The Onkyo equivalent is the PR-SC885P. If you are planning on using the video processing, here is a good lengthy thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=918400

 

[STV]

This unit is only a pre/pro so I dont see how it would/would not 'match' with any particular speaker....

Tj

Hi,

The member that jk319 was referring to is me. Yes I am very familiar with the Integra sound (in my case Integra Research). I personally think that Integra products are great and well designed, but when I had an Integra Research RDC-7, I was not at all pleased with the way it sounded on my Logans. The sound character was just a bit too bright for my taste.

2 channel exhibited this to a degree, but it was really prominent with multichannel movie soundtracks. I liked the RDC-7 and really would have liked to have kept it, but my ears were telling me otherwise.

From what I have learned from using various brands of pre/pro's (Interga Research, Krell, Sunfire, Lexicon etc.), is that each unit offers a very different sound. And that not all pre/pro's sound great with all speaker types. Some are great matches while other are not. I find this more true than ever when using Martin Logans. Martin Logans are very revealing of the equipment used.

In my experience ML's tend to sound their best when combined with warmer sounding pre's and source components. I have auditioned Classe' gear (amps, pre-amps, pre/pro's) and found them to be a great match with Logans. Likewise Sunfire is a perfect match IMO. Now while I haven't listened or used a Denon pre/pro, I am very familiar with the Denon sound with Logans. I used to own a Denon AVR 5800 and I used it with Scenario's and later Aerius i's, and it sounded great!

I kept it in my system for over a year, and only changed it out as I was wanting true separates. So in my experience there is definitely sound differences between pre/pro's.

Now Integra's used with cone based speakers is a whole other story. I used an Onkyo 919 receiver with an all Paradigm setup and the sound it produced was phenomenal! I was so impressed with that setup that I used it for 7 years. But pre/pro's with brighter sounding signatures in my experience are not a good match with Logans. I've found the following pre/pro brands to go great with ML's:

Anthem
Classe'
Denon
Mark Levinson
NAD
Simaudio
Sunfire
Theta

I'm sure there are others, but these are actually ones that I found to sound really good with ML's.





Seth

 

[Tj Bassi]

Seth-

Your point is well taken. I dont have the experience with ML's and various pre/pro's you have; my buddy with the Integra is not a ML owner (yet) and I've only had two processors in ten years, currently running a CBIII.


I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Simaudio. I've yet to hear one of their preamps, but did get the opportunity to absolutely drool over an Andromeda a few weeks back.


Tj

 

[STV]

Seth-

Your point is well taken. I don't have the experience with ML's and various pre/pro's you have; my buddy with the Integra is not a ML owner (yet) and I've only had two processors in ten years, currently running a CBIII.


I'd love to hear your thoughts on the Simaudio. I've yet to hear one of their preamps, but did get the opportunity to absolutely drool over an Andromeda a few weeks back.


Tj

You're using a Theta CBIII, Excellent! That is one fine sounding AV controller. And the Theta and Classe' were at the very top of my list before I learned about the Denon AVP-A1HD. And if the Theta and Classe' had offered everything (or most anyway), that the Denon has, it would be a much tougher decision for me.

Re Simaudio, the sound is very similar to that of Classe', meaning that the sound is a bit more analog sounding and not so digital. The sound is smooth and very refined. Simaudio gear is some of the finest sounding out there. And yes that Andromeda with its matching power supply is one sweet looking unit (all 60 lbs of it). It's interesting to note that both Classe' and Simaudio are companies based in Canada. I've found most Canadian made electronics and speakers to be among the best out there.

One that I have been told that also sounds really good with ML's is Meridian. The 861 is of course reference, but their newer G series looks pretty darn nice also.


Seth

 

[DrJRapp]

I own a DTC 9.8 for my dedicated theater and have to disagree about how it sounds with MLs...for theater use. After it was properly run in it wasn't harsh at all. I found that it does better with copper ICs than it does with silver, but that may purely be a function of my own amp combination.

The 9.8 was designed and built to be a state of the art surround sound processor with a high value/cost ratio. In that capacity it excels. It was never intended for heavy two channel use. I found that keeping my Summits hidden away in my dedicated theater was a waste so I moved them to a dedicated 2 channel high end system in my family room, sold off my Theater i and bought Klipsch References for the theater.

I realize that there are those that don't have the resources in either space or $$ to have dedicated 2 channel and dedicated theater room space and systems. For those I would recommend a good preamp (perhaps tube) with home theater bypass.

 

[Burke]

TJ,

I have lusted after a Theta CB-III, but they haven't finished the HDMI card for it , so I will just have to wait some more. Hopefully the new owners / investors will getting things at Theta rolling again.

I did pick up my Integra DTC-9.8 this morning. I am still waiting to receive the Sanders mono blocks, so it will be at least a week before I have it running correctly. Although if I get impatient I may test it out in 2 / 4 channel mode since I have amps for that.

--burke

 

[STV]

I own a DTC 9.8 for my dedicated theater and have to disagree about how it sounds with MLs...for theater use. After it was properly run in it wasn't harsh at all. I found that it does better with copper ICs than it does with silver, but that may purely be a function of my own amp combination.

The 9.8 was designed and built to be a state of the art surround sound processor with a high value/cost ratio. In that capacity it excels. It was never intended for heavy two channel use. I found that keeping my Summits hidden away in my dedicated theater was a waste so I moved them to a dedicated 2 channel high end system in my family room, sold off my Theater i and bought Klipsch References for the theater.

I realize that there are those that don't have the resources in either space or $$ to have dedicated 2 channel and dedicated theater room space and systems. For those I would recommend a good preamp (perhaps tube) with home theater bypass.

That's good to know that it sounds good in your setup. But much has changed with DAC's/DSP's etc, over the past 4-5 years. So it is quite possible that the DAC's used in the Integra Research RDC-7 I had didn't match well sonically with my Logans. This new Integra DTC-9.8 uses all new DAC's, so it is quite possible that the sound from this unit actually does sound good with Martin Logans. You've got me very curious about this now.

So I'm sure a lot has to do with the DAC's/DSP's used along with other processing boards, etc. If anyone else gets this unit and uses it with their ML's I'd like to know your thoughts on the sound.



Seth

 

[Audiophiliac]

grrrrr....I am having a time choosing what to get for my HT electronics.....I have a great accomodation on Integra and just got a better one from Denon. I am planning on a Denon BluRay player, and might just get the 4308 receiver while I am at it. Although the Integra 9.8 + Rotel class D amps is also a nicer option....more expensive too.....I dunno...I dunno....too many choices.

 

[jk319]

The 9.8 was designed and built to be a state of the art surround sound processor with a high value/cost ratio. In that capacity it excels.

Dr Rapp, thanks for your input. Are you using the Audyssey feature, and if so, could you please share your experiences with it? Did you get a chance to use them on the ML's, or were they already spun off by the time you implemented the 9.8? Thanks!

I realize that there are those that don't have the resources in either space or $$ to have dedicated 2 channel and dedicated theater room space and systems. For those I would recommend a good preamp (perhaps tube) with home theater bypass.

I've been mulling this over for what seems like months, lol.

grrrrr....I am having a time choosing what to get for my HT electronics..... is also a nicer option....more expensive too.....I dunno...I dunno....too many choices.

You and me both man, you and me both.

 

[SundayNiagara]

I sat in on an audition of the Integra 9.8 yesterday; first time I'd seen one let alone had the chance to demo. Quite impressive....balanced outputs, lossless over HDMI, Audyssey room correction, even a phono input (!) Having walked into the demo a little late I wasnt shown the equipment rack until later in the evening after we'd gone thru a few discs and a handful of movie clips. From the sound quality I would have guessed they were running a fairly high-end processor. My buddy had once mentioned upgrading to a Lexicon and I guessed he had done that. Wrong! The Integra is definitely an impressive pre/pro......and lists for around TEN times less than my Casablanca

Has anyone else here spent any time with the Integra? It is my understanding that it is similiar to one of the Onkyo processors but I havent confirmed which one, or how similiar.

Tj

I'll bet it was better analog circuitry that gave you the better sound.

 

[DrJRapp]

Dr Rapp, thanks for your input. Are you using the Audyssey feature, and if so, could you please share your experiences with it? Did you get a chance to use them on the ML's, or were they already spun off by the time you implemented the 9.8? Thanks!
:

I have Audyssy on two different devices. A Denon receiver that is used for 5.1 casual listening in my FR and the Integra in the dedicated theater. I spent a day chasing Audye
ssy settijngs in the FR and it never made sound better than mediocre.

After 48 years as an audiophile and having spent lots of time time in recording sudios making singles and LPs with a band I produced I do a pretty good job setting things up on my own, both the objective parameters that Audyssey sometimes handles well, and the subjective...that no computer can comprehend, yet alone compensate for. It's a nice feature for those of you that have difficult rooms, that don't want to be bothered going through a rigorus manual trial and error setup, and the Pros that can't invest that amount of time in every system.

 

[Tj Bassi]

TJ,

I have lusted after a Theta CB-III, but they haven't finished the HDMI card for it , so I will just have to wait some more. Hopefully the new owners / investors will getting things at Theta rolling again.

I did pick up my Integra DTC-9.8 this morning. I am still waiting to receive the Sanders mono blocks, so it will be at least a week before I have it running correctly. Although if I get impatient I may test it out in 2 / 4 channel mode since I have amps for that.

--burke

Theta is so far behind that it will take a miracle of engineering to get the Casablanca into the mainstream in terms of connectivity. With the CB3 Theta had finally come up with a great OS that eliminated all of the problems previous versions had but we've been waiting quite some time for the promised hardware improvements.
I have this strange feeling the new owners might drop the III in favor of an entirely new (read: economical, less modular) hardware platform. Just a gut-feeling, I have no definite knowledge of whats going on.

Tj

 

[Tj Bassi]

I'll bet it was better analog circuitry that gave you the better sound.

No, all listening was done with sources connected to digital inputs. Further tests this past weekend with my TT and tape deck seems to indicate, as others have mentioned both here and in reviews, that the digital performance of the Integra far exceeds what it does with two channel.
Of course, in discussing the 9.8, I never really intended to use it for anything but HT/multichannel duty in a second system.

Tj

 

[Burke]

First impressions

I spent Sunday afternoon rewiring the HT, to install the Integra DTC-9.8

Current Setup:
Oppo DV-981HD as CD/SACD/DVD-A source connected via HDMI
Sony BDP-500 Blu-Ray for movies.
Integra DTC-9.8 pre/pro
Sanders ESL amplifier (Left / Right ) -> Summits
Sunfire Symphonic Reference (Surround L/R) -> Script i
Pioneer VSX-74 as three channel power amp (Back L/R) -> Script i
(Center) -> Stage
LFE / Subwoofer ->Descent i
All amplifiers are connected via single ended (not balanced).

Basic Speaker distance / size / balance is manually set but, Audssey EQ not run.

My first impression of about 4 hours listening time is very good. The Integra DACs seem better than those on the Pioneer receiver it is replacing. Very musical and not harsh at all. The video, HDMI switching, operating in through mode (Integra is not upconverting, just passing through) is much better than the Pioneer.

Blu-Ray and Direct TV HD look and sound great.
Most listening has been done with the Oppo and various SACDs
Modern Cool, Patrica Barber
Time Out, Dave Bruebuck
The Girl in the Other Room, Diana Krall
Brothers in Arms, Dire Straights
Casino Royale, Herb Alpert (DVD-A 192/24)

The sound is crisp and clear. For me this is a keeper. I can hardly wait the Sanders amps and balanced interconnet cables to arrive and really hear this sing.

--burke

 

[STV]

My first impression of about 4 hours listening time is very good. The Integra DACs seem better than those on the Pioneer receiver it is replacing. Very musical and not harsh at all.

The sound is crisp and clear. For me this is a keeper. I can hardly wait the Sanders amps and balanced interconnet cables to arrive and really hear this sing.

--burke

Too cool! Looks like Integra has a winner with this one! Glad to know it doesn't sound harsh, too bad the Integra Research RDC-7 I had didn't sound like this one does. But this is good to know as this is now one that I can recommend to others that own ML's who want a great sounding pre/pro at a reasonable price. Thanks for sharing your initial impressions.

Congrats on your purchase and enjoy!



Seth

 

[jzoz01]

How can I resize these?

I just picked up the 9.8 about 2 weeks ago. Haven't had a chance to hook it up yet. Should get around to it on Sunday though, I'll let you know what I think. It replaced my Sunfire TGIV, and I have very high hopes for it. The chassis is huge and about as heavy as a decent receiver. I won't have any analog sources, so everything will be digital, where this unit really shines.

 

[asindc]

... My first impression of about 4 hours listening time is very good. The Integra DACs seem better than those on the Pioneer receiver it is replacing. Very musical and not harsh at all. The video, HDMI switching, operating in through mode (Integra is not upconverting, just passing through) is much better than the Pioneer.

Blu-Ray and Direct TV HD look and sound great.
Most listening has been done with the Oppo and various SACDs
Modern Cool, Patrica Barber
Time Out, Dave Bruebuck
The Girl in the Other Room, Diana Krall
Brothers in Arms, Dire Straights
Casino Royale, Herb Alpert (DVD-A 192/24)

The sound is crisp and clear. For me this is a keeper. I can hardly wait the Sanders amps and balanced interconnet cables to arrive and really hear this sing.

--burke

Burke,

You are really going to like the sound using the balanced inputs. And I agree with you that the 9.8 is clearly superior to the Pioneer Elite 74TXvi from a sound standpoint. The Pio Elite 74 produced the glare and brightness typical of HT processors, but the 9.8 is much more musical. I think you would have to spend at least $1,000 new on a 2ch preamp to get significantly better sound (just my own impressions, not based on anything but memory comparisons).

Anthony