New Impression 11A's
- Thread starter Marty1
- Start date
Help Support MartinLogan Audio Owners Forum:
sleepysurf
Well-known member
I presume you'll feed the Yamaha pre-outs to the Parasound amp. Unless you plan on blasting hard rock/heavy metal at 90+ dB, I would expect that Parasound amp to be more than sufficient (160 watts into 8 Ω, and 240 watts into 4 Ω). Ideally, it would be nice if it doubles output yet again into 2 Ω, but probably not necessary (unless the amps protection circuitry triggers when driving the stat panels at higher volumes).
If buying from a local dealer, can you demo the amp with the Impressions before buying?
If buying from a local dealer, can you demo the amp with the Impressions before buying?
15 x 28 is a fairly large room. If I am not mistaken you will need a more powerful power amp.
Otherwise you may get weak sound or not open sonics from Impression. Amp may also clip when high volume may be desired. Parasound A21 plus may be a better choice in this regard.
My son had a very similar room size using 13's but he was using the Parasound integrated. I would highly recommend this amp for this room size as I do agree the A23 will be a bit undersized. Also with the Parasound you get a great DAC. They recently updated the integrated in the last year or so maybe you can find the original one as used at a great price which would be far better then a new A23. I use 3-A23's for my surrounds only and find them plenty good for that only.
TomDac
former MLO owner/operator
Nice sized room for those. Do you already have the Yamaha? I'm not a huge fan of their gear, so that wouldn't be my choice. I'd look at Denon if you need to have the room for HT duties too, otherwise go with a proper pre-amp or integrated.
Hear Here
Well-known member
Marty - where are you based? With a room that size, I wonder if the 11A will be slightly out of its depth. Borderline perhaps depending on room acoustics and type and volume of music I suppose.
In any event, please add a sketch of your room and where you plan to place the speakers as I have experience on where MLs will sound unsatisfactory.
Sanders Magtech is an amp that's often quoted as ideal for MLs and other electrostatic speakers. Unfortunately I've sold mine, but the Gamut D200 is another very suitable amp, though I believe Gamut are in the process of re-working their amps - hopefully by adding relays to prevent the serious thump on powering up or down - a problem with high efficiency speakers and not serious on MLs! Peter
Hear Here
Well-known member
I guess the speakers will be placed along the 15 ft wall - the wall in the photo.
This would be fine. I was worried that you may be thinking of placing them in open space ie well away from any wall behind them. My experience is that MLs don't like an open space behind them. Unfortunately in my big semi-circular room, that's exactly where my speakers need to be and my 13As sounded very unsatisfactory, even with PBK adjustment. So they are for sale to anyone in the UK looking for a pair of perfect and effectively unused 13A speakers in high gloss black.
This would be fine. I was worried that you may be thinking of placing them in open space ie well away from any wall behind them. My experience is that MLs don't like an open space behind them. Unfortunately in my big semi-circular room, that's exactly where my speakers need to be and my 13As sounded very unsatisfactory, even with PBK adjustment. So they are for sale to anyone in the UK looking for a pair of perfect and effectively unused 13A speakers in high gloss black.
amey01
Well-known member
Because you want an extra 3dB?
Really, you don't need it ......IF.......the specs are otherwise the same.
But I'm not familiar with those Parasound amps - if the smaller amp is the "same thing with less power" it is probably okay - but usually bigger amps are made better and generally sound better.
So it depends.
Best to have a listen for yourself.
FWIW My Krell is 150/300/600 @ 8/4/2 and has way more power than needed for my 13A. But I like my lower power tube amps which are 125 watts, but I use them in Triode mode which cuts the power in half and the speakers can get louder than I've ever wanted to try. I stopped at 110dB for a very short period test just to see what would happen. And my room is around 5500 cubic feet.
It's the glorious sound and detailed soundstage that I love with the tube amps. Don't get me wrong, with the Krell they sound great, but greater with tubes. More alive.
Also, don't let price sway any opinion. I tried amps 4 times more costly than my Krell and they just didn't like stats. 5 seconds into the first song it was very apparent they weren't a match.
Take the above suggestions and give them a whirl.
It's the glorious sound and detailed soundstage that I love with the tube amps. Don't get me wrong, with the Krell they sound great, but greater with tubes. More alive.
Also, don't let price sway any opinion. I tried amps 4 times more costly than my Krell and they just didn't like stats. 5 seconds into the first song it was very apparent they weren't a match.
Take the above suggestions and give them a whirl.
amey01
Well-known member
Good advice. Very few amps are designed for; or tested with; 'stats. So caveat emptor.
As for all speakers, some amps are a terrible match. But in the case of 'stats, a bad match is 1. more common; and 2. more pronounced; 3. more untenable to live with.
That not any combi works is a known fact and I'll buy that for stats it's even more so. However, it seems ml has tested their speakers with a range of amps and found most suitable, even 8ohm amps (although there is remark about long time at high volume can cause issues). I had a 8 ohm only receiver and did listen to loud music at long periods of time without any of issue. And right now using my amp in bridge mode also only 8 ohms in this mode with good results. By loud I mean ninety some dB not 110+
For the sake of clarity, that 110dB test was just that, a test lasting a few seconds. I wanted to see if there was a limit, and there was, the limit was my tolerance for such an event, but the amps and speakers were happy to oblige. The point of this is that roughly 70 watts is capable of driving these speakers to intolerable volume with great clarity. I still don't understand why this is possible.
Normally when I'm auditioning something I have a routine that includes a list of music pieces with the first one being an old cathedral organ, a particular crescendo passage of which helps to set the volume which I set to 95dB peaks, strong enough to extract weakness but not too loud to tolerate.
Normally when I'm auditioning something I have a routine that includes a list of music pieces with the first one being an old cathedral organ, a particular crescendo passage of which helps to set the volume which I set to 95dB peaks, strong enough to extract weakness but not too loud to tolerate.
Clear enough. I was aiming at the amp's capabilitity, in particular only 8 ohms amps, over an extended period of time at loud volumes. I can in principle go 275w and same experience as you - sound is stil crisp and clear, although not something I'd like to sit in for a long time.
greg2putt
Well-known member
I agree that Yamaha is a nice Receiver but have you considered Marantz PreAmp? I own and love the Marantz 8802a. As you probably know Denon and Marantz are part of the same corporation but they musically are somewhat different in how they present sound. I've read that 'musically' the Marantz is superior to the Denon lineup.
Again, as others have suggested it's best to listen to components together.
Regarding AMPS... I have Jeff Roland powering my Expressions (250w) and will in the next few years upgrade to the highly recommended Sanders Magtech. Note that I have a Parasound A31 to power my fronts and rears.
Bottom line.... to avoid amp upgradeitis I'd suggest you get more quality power +250Watts to start and consider Denon/Marantz receiver or prepro in place of Yamaha.
Again, as others have suggested it's best to listen to components together.
Regarding AMPS... I have Jeff Roland powering my Expressions (250w) and will in the next few years upgrade to the highly recommended Sanders Magtech. Note that I have a Parasound A31 to power my fronts and rears.
Bottom line.... to avoid amp upgradeitis I'd suggest you get more quality power +250Watts to start and consider Denon/Marantz receiver or prepro in place of Yamaha.
I had maranz and can't complain. But I just was not entirely happy. So I ended with Arcam (class g) indecently the same as JBL and Lexicon receivers. We'll your ears are to decide. And the new line up of Arcam (surely goes for the class g JBL and Lexicon) does suffer from firmware bugs.
Hear Here
Well-known member
I have Expression 13As (now for sale) and bought a Magtech to power them, although I already had a GamuT D200 Mk III. The Sanders was good, but I'm not sure better than the GamuT. However the Sanders was not good with other more efficient speakers as it was decidedly noisy. You probably won't notice this on inefficient ML speakers but it's something to bear in mind - get a home trial beforehand, though I believe Sanders offers that as standard - and has very few returned. Peter
so effectively you're dealing with a width of 12'6", the 11's will be just fine. As for not wanting open space behind them,100% false, min of 2' out from the wall, 4-6' ideal.
Similar threads
